[grammatim[_2_]]

On Feb 21, 11:53*am, Ashok Kothare
wrote:
Dear Grammatim, you have again got on wrong footing. We are talking of
windows and not mac.

Yes. I have been telling you that Windows handles this _better_ than
Mac.

Interesting enough my fonts come very well on both O/S,
linux and mac. Second point you have talked of, me getting money from the
fonts, there again you have gone wrong. I have been giving my fonts to
interested people free of cost. Even to Microsoft Corporation I want to offer
them 'as user' these fonts without any cost. So Microsoft, if accept my offer
they are not going to pay me for using my fonts. You may wonder then why am I
doing this, well, that shall be discussed with Microsoft when time comes. You
say some fonts you are using are unicode based and so you feel that Devnagri
unicode is available. There
again you go wrong. If you have a font making programmer (many are available
on internet) you will see that all the Devnagri fonts you are using are based
on unicode of English and not Devnagri!

You are simply wrong. Open the "Insert Symbol" panel in Word, set the
font to Tahoma and the encoding to Unicode, and you will see a drop-
down menu listing the character ranges available in the font. You will
see a variety of Indic scripts included there.

If you double-click on any of the Indic characters included, it will
be inserted into your document, and if you try to change its font to
some "English"-only font, it will not change.

It is clear from what you write below that you do not know how to use
the resources built into every Windows computer. Since you are not
willing to learn, there is no point in attempting to communicate with
you further.

And the site you should be visiting is called unicode.org.

I happen to own the printed book of the Unicode Standard v. 1.0, and
all the way back in 1991 it included all nine Indic scripts of India,
fully implemented. (Sinhala was not included, perhaps because India
had better connections with the computing world than Sri Lanka.)

If you want to know more about
unicode position of Devnagri you may open a web site called Bhashaindia.com
and you will come to know that the process is still going on and no final
decision is done. I, having interest in fonts, have been studying it
regularly. Actually what allotments are made are such that a workable font
just can
not be made from that table. And so we have to depend on English unicode for
some more time. All the fonts you talk about are as I said are driver based
and they are not acceptable to internet browsers. Only keyboard based fonts
are easily workable at present and that is why not a single browser and so
server are having the fonts you have mentioned on their font file. I talked
about keyboard requiring more than 105 keys because I want the keyboard to
accept all devnagri fonts without a driver programme to support it. You were
correct in saying that you can write using your normal English keyboard with
those fonts and that is because only driver based fonts can come on English
keyboard. Particularly for joint words called 'jodakshar' help of driver is a
must. Then you may ask, if so, how your font work with English keyboard? To
solve this problem I use segments of each breakable consonant in Devnagri.
Method popularly known as type writer mode. Because of that I can get all the
characters and also joining them correctly to get 'jodakshar' without any
difficulty. This of course, makes writing a little slow but that is not a big
problem. We have been using type writer for a long time and this was the only
method used on those machines. I am sure if Microsoft accepts this offer
business of Microsoft in Indian market will be greatly improved since, at
present only English knowing people mainly use computers. When devnagri will
be possible all local language people who are a great number will work on
computers adding to the business. My main interest as I have given hint
earlier is with internet use of my fonts. All the fonts you have talked of
are not acceptable to internet for reasons already mentioned. And so I expect
that my offer will be accepted by Microsoft and we work together. You have
asked about the type of my font. My fonts are true type.
Thanks for the interesting interaction I had with you, Grammatim. I hope
this clears your doubts about necessity of my offer.



"grammatim" wrote:
On Feb 21, 6:07 am, Ashok Kothare
wrote:
Dear Grammatim, we are working for windows and not mac.

I was explaining to you that Windows handles this _better_ than Mac,
because Unicode is fully implemented.

One more point he
missed is that my fonts are free of cost. Interesting enough my fonts work
very well on both mac and linux.

You never said -- are they TrueType? or are they PostScript?

XP has now devnagari fonts but to activate
them one need go in controll panel and activate the driver to make them
functional.

A very simple procedure that needs to be done only once. If you buy a
computer in India, it presumably comes with those "drivers" already
activated, because your operating system presumably is set for Hindi,
Tamil, etc.

unless thet are supported by such drivers they cannot come and it
is experienced that quite often XP fails to activate them and one is
helpless.

Admittedly, I have never heard of anyone having trouble activating
them, but I have not known many people who tried.

Quite often computer stops responding and one has to close the
machine. Luckily Grammtim's computer is working well. But when he may
experience this he will admit usefullness of my fonts! With my fonts this
situation can not arrive because my fonts are based on keyboard default
driver. And so thery are more relieble. Grammatim may not be aware that
Indian users are not so competent to work all that.

Neither am I, certainly. I never used a Windows computer before
September 2005 and very shortly I was familiar with typing in non-
Roman scripts.

Before that, I used precisely the sort of fonts you are describing,
ones that sit uncomforably on top of roman-alphabet fonts, where
nearly all the compound aksharas had to be typed by using keys other
than the ones for the basic consonant aksharas.

A very specialised
working that XP needs is not understood by these people accrding to my
experience.

You just said that Indians are stupid!

So to make work easy for our indian users my fonts are today
found to be of much use . Grammatim, this is not just writing text but my
intention is to make available fonts on internet also. Devnagari fonts with
extra driver are not accepted easily by many browsers and also servers such
as hotmail, goggle, yahoo etc. Since my fonts are ASCII based (english
unicode) they can be easily accepted by these servers. If servers accept
these fonts business in email and other internet activity shall grow in
volumes.

If they are not found on every individual's computer, then those
individuals will not be able to read those websites. If the websites
use Unicode-encoded characters, then anyone with a basic Windows
installation (XP or Vista, at least, and probably earlier ones as
well) will be able to read the websites.

Today people can not communicate properly in english and so email
activity is limited to english only but when my fonts are made available to
them people will spend more time on internet and that is business.

People happily transliterate non-roman-alphabet languages into roman
alphabet for using email in any language.

And so my
suggestion is having many hidden benefits which we can not discuss on this
platform.

_None_ of this topic is appropriate on this newsgroup.

I hope my explanation clears the doubts about extra usefullnes of my fonts
to windows and internet.
I must thank grammtim for the lively interaction. Sadly I did not find any
new point in his reaction.
Actually I had sent one reply a little while ago but I felt that the reply
is not sent and so this is second reply.

Yes, this is the first response to my posting at 11:05 am on Feb 19.

"grammatim" wrote:
On Feb 19, 9:55 am, Ashok Kothare
wrote:
Both Vikrant and grammatin have missed the issue. As for vikrant I must say
thanks for atleast admiring my effort to help writing Indian languages with
english keyboard. Grammatin may not be knowing that unicode for devnagari are
still not standardised.

If Devanagari is in Unicode (and it is), then by definition it is
standardized. I happen to have the Sanskrit and Hindi IMEs activated
on my computer at the moment and I have no trouble typing Sanskrit and
Hindi, on my ordinary 107-key keyboard.

Even if tommorrow they are standardised using them
may need a separate multikeyed (126 keys) keyboard. It is a big work to do
all that and so at present using english unicode and english keyboard to
write Indian languages is by far the best option. Grammatin says he used many
fonts and mastering their each key notations was not easy. I agree to his
point and that is because all the fonts he has tried are with special drivers
to get large number of characters on english key board.

No; as I said, I was using a Mac, before Unicode, and there were no
"font drivers" in a Mac: there were only sets of 223 glyphs (255 less
32) assigned to the 223 available slots in an ordinary font. It was in
fact impossible to make all Indian fonts interconvertible, because
compound aksharas are formed differently in the different scripts, but
it was possible to type every one of the ten standard Indic scripts
(Devanagari, Bangla, Gujarati, Gurmukhi, Oriya, Tamil, Telugu,
Kannada, Malayalam, Sinhala) using the standard Mac keyboard, which is
almost identical in layout and inventory to the standard PC keyboard..

Speciality of my
fonts is that I have developed keyboard set up and that is copyrighted.. Fonts
made with that keyboard set up makes it possible to write almost all marathi,
hindi, sindhi, konkani and also bhojpuri and such modern indian languages but
for sanskrit only up to 95% can be writen. And that is not a big problem
since, my expectation is that these fonts are used for modern languages and
not sanskrit. By one estimate user of modern languages are 99.999% and user
of sanskrit are the rest 0.001%, this may explain my point.

Then, I'm sorry to say, your product is not adequate -- the Mac fonts
and keyboard software created by Ecological Linguistics in the 1980s
and 1990s could handle _all_ the needs of all the languages, classical
and modern.

...

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