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Tom B Tom B is offline
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Posts: 37
Default how do i enable the old menu bar

How do we turn on the old menu bar in word 2007? Without it office 2007 will
cost far to much to implement because employee's will need to be retrained.
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Patrick Schmid [MVP] Patrick Schmid [MVP] is offline
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Posts: 283
Default how do i enable the old menu bar

There is no old menu bar in Office 2007. Your employees will have to
learn the Ribbon UI if you upgrade to 2007.

Patrick Schmid [OneNote MVP]
--------------
http://pschmid.net
***
Office 2007 RTM Issues: http://pschmid.net/blog/2006/11/13/80
Office 2007 Beta 2 Technical Refresh (B2TR):
http://pschmid.net/blog/2006/09/18/43
***
Customize Office 2007: http://pschmid.net/office2007/customize
RibbonCustomizer Add-In: http://pschmid.net/office2007/ribboncustomizer
OneNote 2007: http://pschmid.net/office2007/onenote
***
Subscribe to my Office 2007 blog: http://pschmid.net/blog/feed

"Tom B" wrote in message
:

How do we turn on the old menu bar in word 2007? Without it office 2007 will
cost far to much to implement because employee's will need to be retrained.


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Tom B Tom B is offline
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Posts: 37
Default how do i enable the old menu bar

Then that alone close any implementation plans for office 2007. If a number
of companies follow the same path as ours then the low rate corporate
acceptance will encourage development of an application that has an
acceptable ROI.

Thanks for the reply and we look forward to the service pack

"Patrick Schmid [MVP]" wrote:

There is no old menu bar in Office 2007. Your employees will have to
learn the Ribbon UI if you upgrade to 2007.

Patrick Schmid [OneNote MVP]
--------------
http://pschmid.net
***
Office 2007 RTM Issues: http://pschmid.net/blog/2006/11/13/80
Office 2007 Beta 2 Technical Refresh (B2TR):
http://pschmid.net/blog/2006/09/18/43
***
Customize Office 2007: http://pschmid.net/office2007/customize
RibbonCustomizer Add-In: http://pschmid.net/office2007/ribboncustomizer
OneNote 2007: http://pschmid.net/office2007/onenote
***
Subscribe to my Office 2007 blog: http://pschmid.net/blog/feed

"Tom B" wrote in message
:

How do we turn on the old menu bar in word 2007? Without it office 2007 will
cost far to much to implement because employee's will need to be retrained.



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Suzanne S. Barnhill Suzanne S. Barnhill is offline
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Posts: 33,624
Default how do i enable the old menu bar

Adoption of any new Office version is always slow in corporate America,
which has considerable investment in training custom solutions for a given
version, not to mention the software itself. But MS claims that reception of
the new version is good.

--
Suzanne S. Barnhill
Microsoft MVP (Word)
Words into Type
Fairhope, Alabama USA
Word MVP FAQ site: http://word.mvps.org
Email cannot be acknowledged; please post all follow-ups to the newsgroup so
all may benefit.

"Tom B" wrote in message
...
Then that alone close any implementation plans for office 2007. If a

number
of companies follow the same path as ours then the low rate corporate
acceptance will encourage development of an application that has an
acceptable ROI.

Thanks for the reply and we look forward to the service pack

"Patrick Schmid [MVP]" wrote:

There is no old menu bar in Office 2007. Your employees will have to
learn the Ribbon UI if you upgrade to 2007.

Patrick Schmid [OneNote MVP]
--------------
http://pschmid.net
***
Office 2007 RTM Issues: http://pschmid.net/blog/2006/11/13/80
Office 2007 Beta 2 Technical Refresh (B2TR):
http://pschmid.net/blog/2006/09/18/43
***
Customize Office 2007: http://pschmid.net/office2007/customize
RibbonCustomizer Add-In: http://pschmid.net/office2007/ribboncustomizer
OneNote 2007: http://pschmid.net/office2007/onenote
***
Subscribe to my Office 2007 blog: http://pschmid.net/blog/feed

"Tom B" wrote in message
:

How do we turn on the old menu bar in word 2007? Without it office

2007 will
cost far to much to implement because employee's will need to be

retrained.



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Graham Mayor Graham Mayor is offline
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Posts: 19,312
Default how do i enable the old menu bar

Well they would say that - they have stockholders to consider
It will be interesting to see what the *actual* take-up figures are like.
For many businesses 2007 is an answer to a problem they haven't got (until
MS pulls the plug on 2003).

--

Graham Mayor - Word MVP

My web site www.gmayor.com
Word MVP web site http://word.mvps.org


Suzanne S. Barnhill wrote:
Adoption of any new Office version is always slow in corporate
America, which has considerable investment in training custom
solutions for a given version, not to mention the software itself.
But MS claims that reception of the new version is good.


"Tom B" wrote in message
...
Then that alone close any implementation plans for office 2007. If a
number of companies follow the same path as ours then the low rate
corporate acceptance will encourage development of an application
that has an acceptable ROI.

Thanks for the reply and we look forward to the service pack

"Patrick Schmid [MVP]" wrote:

There is no old menu bar in Office 2007. Your employees will have to
learn the Ribbon UI if you upgrade to 2007.

Patrick Schmid [OneNote MVP]
--------------
http://pschmid.net
***
Office 2007 RTM Issues: http://pschmid.net/blog/2006/11/13/80
Office 2007 Beta 2 Technical Refresh (B2TR):
http://pschmid.net/blog/2006/09/18/43
***
Customize Office 2007: http://pschmid.net/office2007/customize
RibbonCustomizer Add-In:
http://pschmid.net/office2007/ribboncustomizer OneNote 2007:
http://pschmid.net/office2007/onenote ***
Subscribe to my Office 2007 blog: http://pschmid.net/blog/feed

"Tom B" wrote in message
:

How do we turn on the old menu bar in word 2007? Without it office
2007 will cost far to much to implement because employee's will
need to be retrained.





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Folstaff Folstaff is offline
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Posts: 6
Default how do i enable the old menu bar

I cannot imagine a user of nearly 15 years, like myself, converting to the
Ribbon UI. This is an unimaginable design blunder.

Some of us are still keyboard-centric (we enter/create vs. access data).
Having to pick up the mouse every time to access what we see is painful at
best.

I was a beta tester for 95. I was in the cheering section for Office XP,
expecially Outlook, and I wouldn't buy Office 2007 personally or recommend it
to anyone who has ever used a computer.

"Suzanne S. Barnhill" wrote:

Adoption of any new Office version is always slow in corporate America,
which has considerable investment in training custom solutions for a given
version, not to mention the software itself. But MS claims that reception of
the new version is good.

--
Suzanne S. Barnhill
Microsoft MVP (Word)
Words into Type
Fairhope, Alabama USA
Word MVP FAQ site: http://word.mvps.org
Email cannot be acknowledged; please post all follow-ups to the newsgroup so
all may benefit.

"Tom B" wrote in message
...
Then that alone close any implementation plans for office 2007. If a

number
of companies follow the same path as ours then the low rate corporate
acceptance will encourage development of an application that has an
acceptable ROI.

Thanks for the reply and we look forward to the service pack

"Patrick Schmid [MVP]" wrote:

There is no old menu bar in Office 2007. Your employees will have to
learn the Ribbon UI if you upgrade to 2007.

Patrick Schmid [OneNote MVP]
--------------
http://pschmid.net
***
Office 2007 RTM Issues: http://pschmid.net/blog/2006/11/13/80
Office 2007 Beta 2 Technical Refresh (B2TR):
http://pschmid.net/blog/2006/09/18/43
***
Customize Office 2007: http://pschmid.net/office2007/customize
RibbonCustomizer Add-In: http://pschmid.net/office2007/ribboncustomizer
OneNote 2007: http://pschmid.net/office2007/onenote
***
Subscribe to my Office 2007 blog: http://pschmid.net/blog/feed

"Tom B" wrote in message
:

How do we turn on the old menu bar in word 2007? Without it office

2007 will
cost far to much to implement because employee's will need to be

retrained.




  #7   Report Post  
Posted to microsoft.public.word.docmanagement
Patrick Schmid [MVP] Patrick Schmid [MVP] is offline
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 283
Default how do i enable the old menu bar

Some of us are still keyboard-centric (we enter/create vs. access
data).
Having to pick up the mouse every time to access what we see is painful at
best.

The ribbon is fully accessible via the keyboard. Press and release Alt
to get started.
In addition, all menu shortcuts (Alt+ something) that you have in 2003
work in 2007 as well. So if you know your keyboard shortcuts by hard,
just keep using them.
You should give the ribbon a chance. It is a monumental change and you
really can only make a good call after having used it for a while (after
all, you need to overcome its unfamiliarity). Also, I suggest you find a
typical user in your organization and have them try it as well.
Experience shows that the users most struggling with the ribbon are
power users, because they know where their features are in the
menu/toolbar system, while beginner/intermediate users often times end
up hunting for a feature. Most corporate users are not power users, but
the people making the decision on whether to roll 2007 out or not
generally are. That is bound to give them a somewhat skewed view on what
the real impact and training needs in the organization will be. I think
2007 requires a much different training approach than previous Office
version. Different in that the users requiring the most training are the
ones who required the least for earlier versions (power users).
As I said already, force yourself to use it exclusively and see how you
feel about a week or two from now (if it's any indication, it took me a
month during the beta to feel familiar with the ribbon and not wanting
to go back to menus/toolbars).
There is a lot of things somewhat hidden that will make your life easier
using it.
Anything surrounding customization:
http://pschmid.net/blog/2006/10/18/68 (this basically lists anything you
can adjust to your personal liking)
Then I would suggest to take a closer look by starting from this post:
http://pschmid.net/blog/2006/10/09/58
You probably want to look at the sections "Overview of the new UI",
"Ribbon UI Elements" and "Keyboard control of the Ribbon". A lot of the
things categorized in this post are extremely worthwhile reading though.

Patrick Schmid [OneNote MVP]
--------------
http://pschmid.net
***
Office 2007 RTM Issues: http://pschmid.net/blog/2006/11/13/80
Office 2007 Beta 2 Technical Refresh (B2TR):
http://pschmid.net/blog/2006/09/18/43
***
Customize Office 2007: http://pschmid.net/office2007/customize
RibbonCustomizer Add-In: http://pschmid.net/office2007/ribboncustomizer
OneNote 2007: http://pschmid.net/office2007/onenote
***
Subscribe to my Office 2007 blog: http://pschmid.net/blog/feed

I was a beta tester for 95. I was in the cheering section for Office XP,
expecially Outlook, and I wouldn't buy Office 2007 personally or recommend it
to anyone who has ever used a computer.

"Suzanne S. Barnhill" wrote:

Adoption of any new Office version is always slow in corporate America,
which has considerable investment in training custom solutions for a given
version, not to mention the software itself. But MS claims that reception of
the new version is good.

--
Suzanne S. Barnhill
Microsoft MVP (Word)
Words into Type
Fairhope, Alabama USA
Word MVP FAQ site: http://word.mvps.org
Email cannot be acknowledged; please post all follow-ups to the newsgroup so
all may benefit.

"Tom B" wrote in message
...
Then that alone close any implementation plans for office 2007. If a

number
of companies follow the same path as ours then the low rate corporate
acceptance will encourage development of an application that has an
acceptable ROI.

Thanks for the reply and we look forward to the service pack

"Patrick Schmid [MVP]" wrote:

There is no old menu bar in Office 2007. Your employees will have to
learn the Ribbon UI if you upgrade to 2007.

Patrick Schmid [OneNote MVP]
--------------
http://pschmid.net
***
Office 2007 RTM Issues: http://pschmid.net/blog/2006/11/13/80
Office 2007 Beta 2 Technical Refresh (B2TR):
http://pschmid.net/blog/2006/09/18/43
***
Customize Office 2007: http://pschmid.net/office2007/customize
RibbonCustomizer Add-In: http://pschmid.net/office2007/ribboncustomizer
OneNote 2007: http://pschmid.net/office2007/onenote
***
Subscribe to my Office 2007 blog: http://pschmid.net/blog/feed

"Tom B" wrote in message
:

How do we turn on the old menu bar in word 2007? Without it office

2007 will
cost far to much to implement because employee's will need to be

retrained.





  #8   Report Post  
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Folstaff Folstaff is offline
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 6
Default how do i enable the old menu bar

I kind of expect your answer, but here it goes: Are you more productive with
the new menu system? Are you faster? Did you time yourself? I know why they
dumb down the interface, but why do they have to drag the install base (at
least 80% of the users of PC's) with them?

I know the alt keys are in place, but it doesn't work the same. If I hit
Alt-E and enter, it does nothing. In 2003, it would undo. That isn't being
picky. I have been using Word, happily, since the first windows version.

"Patrick Schmid [MVP]" wrote:

Some of us are still keyboard-centric (we enter/create vs. access

data).
Having to pick up the mouse every time to access what we see is painful at
best.

The ribbon is fully accessible via the keyboard. Press and release Alt
to get started.
In addition, all menu shortcuts (Alt+ something) that you have in 2003
work in 2007 as well. So if you know your keyboard shortcuts by hard,
just keep using them.
You should give the ribbon a chance. It is a monumental change and you
really can only make a good call after having used it for a while (after
all, you need to overcome its unfamiliarity). Also, I suggest you find a
typical user in your organization and have them try it as well.
Experience shows that the users most struggling with the ribbon are
power users, because they know where their features are in the
menu/toolbar system, while beginner/intermediate users often times end
up hunting for a feature. Most corporate users are not power users, but
the people making the decision on whether to roll 2007 out or not
generally are. That is bound to give them a somewhat skewed view on what
the real impact and training needs in the organization will be. I think
2007 requires a much different training approach than previous Office
version. Different in that the users requiring the most training are the
ones who required the least for earlier versions (power users).
As I said already, force yourself to use it exclusively and see how you
feel about a week or two from now (if it's any indication, it took me a
month during the beta to feel familiar with the ribbon and not wanting
to go back to menus/toolbars).
There is a lot of things somewhat hidden that will make your life easier
using it.
Anything surrounding customization:
http://pschmid.net/blog/2006/10/18/68 (this basically lists anything you
can adjust to your personal liking)
Then I would suggest to take a closer look by starting from this post:
http://pschmid.net/blog/2006/10/09/58
You probably want to look at the sections "Overview of the new UI",
"Ribbon UI Elements" and "Keyboard control of the Ribbon". A lot of the
things categorized in this post are extremely worthwhile reading though.

Patrick Schmid [OneNote MVP]
--------------
http://pschmid.net
***
Office 2007 RTM Issues: http://pschmid.net/blog/2006/11/13/80
Office 2007 Beta 2 Technical Refresh (B2TR):
http://pschmid.net/blog/2006/09/18/43
***
Customize Office 2007: http://pschmid.net/office2007/customize
RibbonCustomizer Add-In: http://pschmid.net/office2007/ribboncustomizer
OneNote 2007: http://pschmid.net/office2007/onenote
***
Subscribe to my Office 2007 blog: http://pschmid.net/blog/feed

I was a beta tester for 95. I was in the cheering section for Office XP,
expecially Outlook, and I wouldn't buy Office 2007 personally or recommend it
to anyone who has ever used a computer.

"Suzanne S. Barnhill" wrote:

Adoption of any new Office version is always slow in corporate America,
which has considerable investment in training custom solutions for a given
version, not to mention the software itself. But MS claims that reception of
the new version is good.

--
Suzanne S. Barnhill
Microsoft MVP (Word)
Words into Type
Fairhope, Alabama USA
Word MVP FAQ site: http://word.mvps.org
Email cannot be acknowledged; please post all follow-ups to the newsgroup so
all may benefit.

"Tom B" wrote in message
...
Then that alone close any implementation plans for office 2007. If a
number
of companies follow the same path as ours then the low rate corporate
acceptance will encourage development of an application that has an
acceptable ROI.

Thanks for the reply and we look forward to the service pack

"Patrick Schmid [MVP]" wrote:

There is no old menu bar in Office 2007. Your employees will have to
learn the Ribbon UI if you upgrade to 2007.

Patrick Schmid [OneNote MVP]
--------------
http://pschmid.net
***
Office 2007 RTM Issues: http://pschmid.net/blog/2006/11/13/80
Office 2007 Beta 2 Technical Refresh (B2TR):
http://pschmid.net/blog/2006/09/18/43
***
Customize Office 2007: http://pschmid.net/office2007/customize
RibbonCustomizer Add-In: http://pschmid.net/office2007/ribboncustomizer
OneNote 2007: http://pschmid.net/office2007/onenote
***
Subscribe to my Office 2007 blog: http://pschmid.net/blog/feed

"Tom B" wrote in message
:

How do we turn on the old menu bar in word 2007? Without it office
2007 will
cost far to much to implement because employee's will need to be
retrained.






  #9   Report Post  
Posted to microsoft.public.word.docmanagement
Patrick Schmid [MVP] Patrick Schmid [MVP] is offline
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 283
Default how do i enable the old menu bar

I kind of expect your answer, but here it goes: Are you more
productive with
the new menu system? Are you faster? Did you time yourself? I know why they
dumb down the interface, but why do they have to drag the install base (at
least 80% of the users of PC's) with them?

Yes, I am more productive and faster.

I know the alt keys are in place, but it doesn't work the same. If I hit
Alt-E and enter, it does nothing. In 2003, it would undo. That isn't being
picky. I have been using Word, happily, since the first windows version.

Hmm, I see. Yes, that kind of scenario isn't supported.

Ironically, I make an add-in that could be used to get the old
menu/toolbar system somewhat back...

Patrick Schmid [OneNote MVP]
--------------
http://pschmid.net
***
Office 2007 RTM Issues: http://pschmid.net/blog/2006/11/13/80
Office 2007 Beta 2 Technical Refresh (B2TR):
http://pschmid.net/blog/2006/09/18/43
***
Customize Office 2007: http://pschmid.net/office2007/customize
RibbonCustomizer Add-In: http://pschmid.net/office2007/ribboncustomizer
OneNote 2007: http://pschmid.net/office2007/onenote
***
Subscribe to my Office 2007 blog: http://pschmid.net/blog/feed

"Patrick Schmid [MVP]" wrote:

Some of us are still keyboard-centric (we enter/create vs. access

data).
Having to pick up the mouse every time to access what we see is painful at
best.

The ribbon is fully accessible via the keyboard. Press and release Alt
to get started.
In addition, all menu shortcuts (Alt+ something) that you have in 2003
work in 2007 as well. So if you know your keyboard shortcuts by hard,
just keep using them.
You should give the ribbon a chance. It is a monumental change and you
really can only make a good call after having used it for a while (after
all, you need to overcome its unfamiliarity). Also, I suggest you find a
typical user in your organization and have them try it as well.
Experience shows that the users most struggling with the ribbon are
power users, because they know where their features are in the
menu/toolbar system, while beginner/intermediate users often times end
up hunting for a feature. Most corporate users are not power users, but
the people making the decision on whether to roll 2007 out or not
generally are. That is bound to give them a somewhat skewed view on what
the real impact and training needs in the organization will be. I think
2007 requires a much different training approach than previous Office
version. Different in that the users requiring the most training are the
ones who required the least for earlier versions (power users).
As I said already, force yourself to use it exclusively and see how you
feel about a week or two from now (if it's any indication, it took me a
month during the beta to feel familiar with the ribbon and not wanting
to go back to menus/toolbars).
There is a lot of things somewhat hidden that will make your life easier
using it.
Anything surrounding customization:
http://pschmid.net/blog/2006/10/18/68 (this basically lists anything you
can adjust to your personal liking)
Then I would suggest to take a closer look by starting from this post:
http://pschmid.net/blog/2006/10/09/58
You probably want to look at the sections "Overview of the new UI",
"Ribbon UI Elements" and "Keyboard control of the Ribbon". A lot of the
things categorized in this post are extremely worthwhile reading though.

Patrick Schmid [OneNote MVP]
--------------
http://pschmid.net
***
Office 2007 RTM Issues: http://pschmid.net/blog/2006/11/13/80
Office 2007 Beta 2 Technical Refresh (B2TR):
http://pschmid.net/blog/2006/09/18/43
***
Customize Office 2007: http://pschmid.net/office2007/customize
RibbonCustomizer Add-In: http://pschmid.net/office2007/ribboncustomizer
OneNote 2007: http://pschmid.net/office2007/onenote
***
Subscribe to my Office 2007 blog: http://pschmid.net/blog/feed

I was a beta tester for 95. I was in the cheering section for Office XP,
expecially Outlook, and I wouldn't buy Office 2007 personally or recommend it
to anyone who has ever used a computer.

"Suzanne S. Barnhill" wrote:

Adoption of any new Office version is always slow in corporate America,
which has considerable investment in training custom solutions for a given
version, not to mention the software itself. But MS claims that reception of
the new version is good.

--
Suzanne S. Barnhill
Microsoft MVP (Word)
Words into Type
Fairhope, Alabama USA
Word MVP FAQ site: http://word.mvps.org
Email cannot be acknowledged; please post all follow-ups to the newsgroup so
all may benefit.

"Tom B" wrote in message
...
Then that alone close any implementation plans for office 2007. If a
number
of companies follow the same path as ours then the low rate corporate
acceptance will encourage development of an application that has an
acceptable ROI.

Thanks for the reply and we look forward to the service pack

"Patrick Schmid [MVP]" wrote:

There is no old menu bar in Office 2007. Your employees will have to
learn the Ribbon UI if you upgrade to 2007.

Patrick Schmid [OneNote MVP]
--------------
http://pschmid.net
***
Office 2007 RTM Issues: http://pschmid.net/blog/2006/11/13/80
Office 2007 Beta 2 Technical Refresh (B2TR):
http://pschmid.net/blog/2006/09/18/43
***
Customize Office 2007: http://pschmid.net/office2007/customize
RibbonCustomizer Add-In: http://pschmid.net/office2007/ribboncustomizer
OneNote 2007: http://pschmid.net/office2007/onenote
***
Subscribe to my Office 2007 blog: http://pschmid.net/blog/feed

"Tom B" wrote in message
:

How do we turn on the old menu bar in word 2007? Without it office
2007 will
cost far to much to implement because employee's will need to be
retrained.







  #10   Report Post  
Posted to microsoft.public.word.docmanagement
Folstaff Folstaff is offline
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 6
Default how do i enable the old menu bar

I have saved a link to your website and if ever forced to convert...

I just cannot understand why they ditched nearly a decade of habits when
improvements in performance, stability, and security would have a greater
impact on the product's reputation. They opened the door for OpenOffice and
they didn't have to.

I spent some time on the live demo. Excel's ribbon's (I use Excel a lot)
were frustrating, but it is a dead horse.



"Patrick Schmid [MVP]" wrote:

I kind of expect your answer, but here it goes: Are you more

productive with
the new menu system? Are you faster? Did you time yourself? I know why they
dumb down the interface, but why do they have to drag the install base (at
least 80% of the users of PC's) with them?

Yes, I am more productive and faster.

I know the alt keys are in place, but it doesn't work the same. If I hit
Alt-E and enter, it does nothing. In 2003, it would undo. That isn't being
picky. I have been using Word, happily, since the first windows version.

Hmm, I see. Yes, that kind of scenario isn't supported.

Ironically, I make an add-in that could be used to get the old
menu/toolbar system somewhat back...

Patrick Schmid [OneNote MVP]
--------------
http://pschmid.net
***
Office 2007 RTM Issues: http://pschmid.net/blog/2006/11/13/80
Office 2007 Beta 2 Technical Refresh (B2TR):
http://pschmid.net/blog/2006/09/18/43
***
Customize Office 2007: http://pschmid.net/office2007/customize
RibbonCustomizer Add-In: http://pschmid.net/office2007/ribboncustomizer
OneNote 2007: http://pschmid.net/office2007/onenote
***
Subscribe to my Office 2007 blog: http://pschmid.net/blog/feed

"Patrick Schmid [MVP]" wrote:

Some of us are still keyboard-centric (we enter/create vs. access
data).
Having to pick up the mouse every time to access what we see is painful at
best.
The ribbon is fully accessible via the keyboard. Press and release Alt
to get started.
In addition, all menu shortcuts (Alt+ something) that you have in 2003
work in 2007 as well. So if you know your keyboard shortcuts by hard,
just keep using them.
You should give the ribbon a chance. It is a monumental change and you
really can only make a good call after having used it for a while (after
all, you need to overcome its unfamiliarity). Also, I suggest you find a
typical user in your organization and have them try it as well.
Experience shows that the users most struggling with the ribbon are
power users, because they know where their features are in the
menu/toolbar system, while beginner/intermediate users often times end
up hunting for a feature. Most corporate users are not power users, but
the people making the decision on whether to roll 2007 out or not
generally are. That is bound to give them a somewhat skewed view on what
the real impact and training needs in the organization will be. I think
2007 requires a much different training approach than previous Office
version. Different in that the users requiring the most training are the
ones who required the least for earlier versions (power users).
As I said already, force yourself to use it exclusively and see how you
feel about a week or two from now (if it's any indication, it took me a
month during the beta to feel familiar with the ribbon and not wanting
to go back to menus/toolbars).
There is a lot of things somewhat hidden that will make your life easier
using it.
Anything surrounding customization:
http://pschmid.net/blog/2006/10/18/68 (this basically lists anything you
can adjust to your personal liking)
Then I would suggest to take a closer look by starting from this post:
http://pschmid.net/blog/2006/10/09/58
You probably want to look at the sections "Overview of the new UI",
"Ribbon UI Elements" and "Keyboard control of the Ribbon". A lot of the
things categorized in this post are extremely worthwhile reading though.

Patrick Schmid [OneNote MVP]
--------------
http://pschmid.net
***
Office 2007 RTM Issues: http://pschmid.net/blog/2006/11/13/80
Office 2007 Beta 2 Technical Refresh (B2TR):
http://pschmid.net/blog/2006/09/18/43
***
Customize Office 2007: http://pschmid.net/office2007/customize
RibbonCustomizer Add-In: http://pschmid.net/office2007/ribboncustomizer
OneNote 2007: http://pschmid.net/office2007/onenote
***
Subscribe to my Office 2007 blog: http://pschmid.net/blog/feed

I was a beta tester for 95. I was in the cheering section for Office XP,
expecially Outlook, and I wouldn't buy Office 2007 personally or recommend it
to anyone who has ever used a computer.

"Suzanne S. Barnhill" wrote:

Adoption of any new Office version is always slow in corporate America,
which has considerable investment in training custom solutions for a given
version, not to mention the software itself. But MS claims that reception of
the new version is good.

--
Suzanne S. Barnhill
Microsoft MVP (Word)
Words into Type
Fairhope, Alabama USA
Word MVP FAQ site: http://word.mvps.org
Email cannot be acknowledged; please post all follow-ups to the newsgroup so
all may benefit.

"Tom B" wrote in message
...
Then that alone close any implementation plans for office 2007. If a
number
of companies follow the same path as ours then the low rate corporate
acceptance will encourage development of an application that has an
acceptable ROI.

Thanks for the reply and we look forward to the service pack

"Patrick Schmid [MVP]" wrote:

There is no old menu bar in Office 2007. Your employees will have to
learn the Ribbon UI if you upgrade to 2007.

Patrick Schmid [OneNote MVP]
--------------
http://pschmid.net
***
Office 2007 RTM Issues: http://pschmid.net/blog/2006/11/13/80
Office 2007 Beta 2 Technical Refresh (B2TR):
http://pschmid.net/blog/2006/09/18/43
***
Customize Office 2007: http://pschmid.net/office2007/customize
RibbonCustomizer Add-In: http://pschmid.net/office2007/ribboncustomizer
OneNote 2007: http://pschmid.net/office2007/onenote
***
Subscribe to my Office 2007 blog: http://pschmid.net/blog/feed

"Tom B" wrote in message
:

How do we turn on the old menu bar in word 2007? Without it office
2007 will
cost far to much to implement because employee's will need to be
retrained.










  #11   Report Post  
Posted to microsoft.public.word.docmanagement
Suzanne S. Barnhill Suzanne S. Barnhill is offline
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 33,624
Default how do i enable the old menu bar

Ctrl+Z will also Undo, and that will still work, I believe.

--
Suzanne S. Barnhill
Microsoft MVP (Word)
Words into Type
Fairhope, Alabama USA
Word MVP FAQ site: http://word.mvps.org
Email cannot be acknowledged; please post all follow-ups to the newsgroup so
all may benefit.

"Folstaff" wrote in message
...
I kind of expect your answer, but here it goes: Are you more productive

with
the new menu system? Are you faster? Did you time yourself? I know why

they
dumb down the interface, but why do they have to drag the install base (at
least 80% of the users of PC's) with them?

I know the alt keys are in place, but it doesn't work the same. If I hit
Alt-E and enter, it does nothing. In 2003, it would undo. That isn't being
picky. I have been using Word, happily, since the first windows version.

"Patrick Schmid [MVP]" wrote:

Some of us are still keyboard-centric (we enter/create vs. access

data).
Having to pick up the mouse every time to access what we see is

painful at
best.

The ribbon is fully accessible via the keyboard. Press and release Alt
to get started.
In addition, all menu shortcuts (Alt+ something) that you have in 2003
work in 2007 as well. So if you know your keyboard shortcuts by hard,
just keep using them.
You should give the ribbon a chance. It is a monumental change and you
really can only make a good call after having used it for a while (after
all, you need to overcome its unfamiliarity). Also, I suggest you find a
typical user in your organization and have them try it as well.
Experience shows that the users most struggling with the ribbon are
power users, because they know where their features are in the
menu/toolbar system, while beginner/intermediate users often times end
up hunting for a feature. Most corporate users are not power users, but
the people making the decision on whether to roll 2007 out or not
generally are. That is bound to give them a somewhat skewed view on what
the real impact and training needs in the organization will be. I think
2007 requires a much different training approach than previous Office
version. Different in that the users requiring the most training are the
ones who required the least for earlier versions (power users).
As I said already, force yourself to use it exclusively and see how you
feel about a week or two from now (if it's any indication, it took me a
month during the beta to feel familiar with the ribbon and not wanting
to go back to menus/toolbars).
There is a lot of things somewhat hidden that will make your life easier
using it.
Anything surrounding customization:
http://pschmid.net/blog/2006/10/18/68 (this basically lists anything you
can adjust to your personal liking)
Then I would suggest to take a closer look by starting from this post:
http://pschmid.net/blog/2006/10/09/58
You probably want to look at the sections "Overview of the new UI",
"Ribbon UI Elements" and "Keyboard control of the Ribbon". A lot of the
things categorized in this post are extremely worthwhile reading though.

Patrick Schmid [OneNote MVP]
--------------
http://pschmid.net
***
Office 2007 RTM Issues: http://pschmid.net/blog/2006/11/13/80
Office 2007 Beta 2 Technical Refresh (B2TR):
http://pschmid.net/blog/2006/09/18/43
***
Customize Office 2007: http://pschmid.net/office2007/customize
RibbonCustomizer Add-In: http://pschmid.net/office2007/ribboncustomizer
OneNote 2007: http://pschmid.net/office2007/onenote
***
Subscribe to my Office 2007 blog: http://pschmid.net/blog/feed

I was a beta tester for 95. I was in the cheering section for Office

XP,
expecially Outlook, and I wouldn't buy Office 2007 personally or

recommend it
to anyone who has ever used a computer.

"Suzanne S. Barnhill" wrote:

Adoption of any new Office version is always slow in corporate

America,
which has considerable investment in training custom solutions for a

given
version, not to mention the software itself. But MS claims that

reception of
the new version is good.

--
Suzanne S. Barnhill
Microsoft MVP (Word)
Words into Type
Fairhope, Alabama USA
Word MVP FAQ site: http://word.mvps.org
Email cannot be acknowledged; please post all follow-ups to the

newsgroup so
all may benefit.

"Tom B" wrote in message
...
Then that alone close any implementation plans for office 2007. If

a
number
of companies follow the same path as ours then the low rate

corporate
acceptance will encourage development of an application that has

an
acceptable ROI.

Thanks for the reply and we look forward to the service pack

"Patrick Schmid [MVP]" wrote:

There is no old menu bar in Office 2007. Your employees will

have to
learn the Ribbon UI if you upgrade to 2007.

Patrick Schmid [OneNote MVP]
--------------
http://pschmid.net
***
Office 2007 RTM Issues: http://pschmid.net/blog/2006/11/13/80
Office 2007 Beta 2 Technical Refresh (B2TR):
http://pschmid.net/blog/2006/09/18/43
***
Customize Office 2007: http://pschmid.net/office2007/customize
RibbonCustomizer Add-In:

http://pschmid.net/office2007/ribboncustomizer
OneNote 2007: http://pschmid.net/office2007/onenote
***
Subscribe to my Office 2007 blog: http://pschmid.net/blog/feed

"Tom B" wrote in message
:

How do we turn on the old menu bar in word 2007? Without it

office
2007 will
cost far to much to implement because employee's will need to

be
retrained.







  #12   Report Post  
Posted to microsoft.public.word.docmanagement
Folstaff Folstaff is offline
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 6
Default how do i enable the old menu bar

It probably does, it just isn't my habit.

I know I am out of step when I look at a mouse as a necessary evil, but here
is my problem, there is no order of keystrokes that I can learn now. So my
productivity will always be limited to the speed at which I can get back to
typing from picking up my mouse.

By and by...I read how this system is based on the statistics from Office
2003. Why would anyone do that? The majority of users were still on Office 97
2 years ago if they still aren't now. Not to mention, people like myself who
would never, and I mean never, choose to have my clicks counted and tracked.
Do we know the percentage of Office (not 2003, not XP, but Office) users who
did?

"Suzanne S. Barnhill" wrote:

Ctrl+Z will also Undo, and that will still work, I believe.

--
Suzanne S. Barnhill
Microsoft MVP (Word)
Words into Type
Fairhope, Alabama USA
Word MVP FAQ site: http://word.mvps.org
Email cannot be acknowledged; please post all follow-ups to the newsgroup so
all may benefit.

"Folstaff" wrote in message
...
I kind of expect your answer, but here it goes: Are you more productive

with
the new menu system? Are you faster? Did you time yourself? I know why

they
dumb down the interface, but why do they have to drag the install base (at
least 80% of the users of PC's) with them?

I know the alt keys are in place, but it doesn't work the same. If I hit
Alt-E and enter, it does nothing. In 2003, it would undo. That isn't being
picky. I have been using Word, happily, since the first windows version.

"Patrick Schmid [MVP]" wrote:

Some of us are still keyboard-centric (we enter/create vs. access
data).
Having to pick up the mouse every time to access what we see is

painful at
best.
The ribbon is fully accessible via the keyboard. Press and release Alt
to get started.
In addition, all menu shortcuts (Alt+ something) that you have in 2003
work in 2007 as well. So if you know your keyboard shortcuts by hard,
just keep using them.
You should give the ribbon a chance. It is a monumental change and you
really can only make a good call after having used it for a while (after
all, you need to overcome its unfamiliarity). Also, I suggest you find a
typical user in your organization and have them try it as well.
Experience shows that the users most struggling with the ribbon are
power users, because they know where their features are in the
menu/toolbar system, while beginner/intermediate users often times end
up hunting for a feature. Most corporate users are not power users, but
the people making the decision on whether to roll 2007 out or not
generally are. That is bound to give them a somewhat skewed view on what
the real impact and training needs in the organization will be. I think
2007 requires a much different training approach than previous Office
version. Different in that the users requiring the most training are the
ones who required the least for earlier versions (power users).
As I said already, force yourself to use it exclusively and see how you
feel about a week or two from now (if it's any indication, it took me a
month during the beta to feel familiar with the ribbon and not wanting
to go back to menus/toolbars).
There is a lot of things somewhat hidden that will make your life easier
using it.
Anything surrounding customization:
http://pschmid.net/blog/2006/10/18/68 (this basically lists anything you
can adjust to your personal liking)
Then I would suggest to take a closer look by starting from this post:
http://pschmid.net/blog/2006/10/09/58
You probably want to look at the sections "Overview of the new UI",
"Ribbon UI Elements" and "Keyboard control of the Ribbon". A lot of the
things categorized in this post are extremely worthwhile reading though.

Patrick Schmid [OneNote MVP]
--------------
http://pschmid.net
***
Office 2007 RTM Issues: http://pschmid.net/blog/2006/11/13/80
Office 2007 Beta 2 Technical Refresh (B2TR):
http://pschmid.net/blog/2006/09/18/43
***
Customize Office 2007: http://pschmid.net/office2007/customize
RibbonCustomizer Add-In: http://pschmid.net/office2007/ribboncustomizer
OneNote 2007: http://pschmid.net/office2007/onenote
***
Subscribe to my Office 2007 blog: http://pschmid.net/blog/feed

I was a beta tester for 95. I was in the cheering section for Office

XP,
expecially Outlook, and I wouldn't buy Office 2007 personally or

recommend it
to anyone who has ever used a computer.

"Suzanne S. Barnhill" wrote:

Adoption of any new Office version is always slow in corporate

America,
which has considerable investment in training custom solutions for a

given
version, not to mention the software itself. But MS claims that

reception of
the new version is good.

--
Suzanne S. Barnhill
Microsoft MVP (Word)
Words into Type
Fairhope, Alabama USA
Word MVP FAQ site: http://word.mvps.org
Email cannot be acknowledged; please post all follow-ups to the

newsgroup so
all may benefit.

"Tom B" wrote in message
...
Then that alone close any implementation plans for office 2007. If

a
number
of companies follow the same path as ours then the low rate

corporate
acceptance will encourage development of an application that has

an
acceptable ROI.

Thanks for the reply and we look forward to the service pack

"Patrick Schmid [MVP]" wrote:

There is no old menu bar in Office 2007. Your employees will

have to
learn the Ribbon UI if you upgrade to 2007.

Patrick Schmid [OneNote MVP]
--------------
http://pschmid.net
***
Office 2007 RTM Issues: http://pschmid.net/blog/2006/11/13/80
Office 2007 Beta 2 Technical Refresh (B2TR):
http://pschmid.net/blog/2006/09/18/43
***
Customize Office 2007: http://pschmid.net/office2007/customize
RibbonCustomizer Add-In:

http://pschmid.net/office2007/ribboncustomizer
OneNote 2007: http://pschmid.net/office2007/onenote
***
Subscribe to my Office 2007 blog: http://pschmid.net/blog/feed

"Tom B" wrote in message
:

How do we turn on the old menu bar in word 2007? Without it

office
2007 will
cost far to much to implement because employee's will need to

be
retrained.








  #13   Report Post  
Posted to microsoft.public.word.docmanagement
Patrick Schmid [MVP] Patrick Schmid [MVP] is offline
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 283
Default how do i enable the old menu bar

Microsoft claims that their statistics were inclusive of power users,
but I doubt it. To read more about what MS has told us and what I think
about that: http://pschmid.net/blog/2006/10/14/66

I know I am out of step when I look at a mouse as a necessary evil, but here
is my problem, there is no order of keystrokes that I can learn now. So my

Can you explain what you mean with order of keystrokes? There is one for
the Ribbon, so I am wondering...


Patrick Schmid [OneNote MVP]
--------------
http://pschmid.net
***
Office 2007 RTM Issues: http://pschmid.net/blog/2006/11/13/80
Office 2007 Beta 2 Technical Refresh (B2TR):
http://pschmid.net/blog/2006/09/18/43
***
Customize Office 2007: http://pschmid.net/office2007/customize
RibbonCustomizer Add-In: http://pschmid.net/office2007/ribboncustomizer
OneNote 2007: http://pschmid.net/office2007/onenote
***
Subscribe to my Office 2007 blog: http://pschmid.net/blog/feed

  #14   Report Post  
Posted to microsoft.public.word.docmanagement
Doug Robbins - Word MVP Doug Robbins - Word MVP is offline
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 8,832
Default how do i enable the old menu bar

By "order of keystrokes", I assume that you mean shortcut key combinations.
I think that you will find that most, if not all of them, are unchanged from
previous versions.

--
Hope this helps.

Please reply to the newsgroup unless you wish to avail yourself of my
services on a paid consulting basis.

Doug Robbins - Word MVP

"Folstaff" wrote in message
...
It probably does, it just isn't my habit.

I know I am out of step when I look at a mouse as a necessary evil, but
here
is my problem, there is no order of keystrokes that I can learn now. So my
productivity will always be limited to the speed at which I can get back
to
typing from picking up my mouse.

By and by...I read how this system is based on the statistics from Office
2003. Why would anyone do that? The majority of users were still on Office
97
2 years ago if they still aren't now. Not to mention, people like myself
who
would never, and I mean never, choose to have my clicks counted and
tracked.
Do we know the percentage of Office (not 2003, not XP, but Office) users
who
did?

"Suzanne S. Barnhill" wrote:

Ctrl+Z will also Undo, and that will still work, I believe.

--
Suzanne S. Barnhill
Microsoft MVP (Word)
Words into Type
Fairhope, Alabama USA
Word MVP FAQ site: http://word.mvps.org
Email cannot be acknowledged; please post all follow-ups to the newsgroup
so
all may benefit.

"Folstaff" wrote in message
...
I kind of expect your answer, but here it goes: Are you more productive

with
the new menu system? Are you faster? Did you time yourself? I know why

they
dumb down the interface, but why do they have to drag the install base
(at
least 80% of the users of PC's) with them?

I know the alt keys are in place, but it doesn't work the same. If I
hit
Alt-E and enter, it does nothing. In 2003, it would undo. That isn't
being
picky. I have been using Word, happily, since the first windows
version.

"Patrick Schmid [MVP]" wrote:

Some of us are still keyboard-centric (we enter/create vs. access
data).
Having to pick up the mouse every time to access what we see is

painful at
best.
The ribbon is fully accessible via the keyboard. Press and release
Alt
to get started.
In addition, all menu shortcuts (Alt+ something) that you have in
2003
work in 2007 as well. So if you know your keyboard shortcuts by hard,
just keep using them.
You should give the ribbon a chance. It is a monumental change and
you
really can only make a good call after having used it for a while
(after
all, you need to overcome its unfamiliarity). Also, I suggest you
find a
typical user in your organization and have them try it as well.
Experience shows that the users most struggling with the ribbon are
power users, because they know where their features are in the
menu/toolbar system, while beginner/intermediate users often times
end
up hunting for a feature. Most corporate users are not power users,
but
the people making the decision on whether to roll 2007 out or not
generally are. That is bound to give them a somewhat skewed view on
what
the real impact and training needs in the organization will be. I
think
2007 requires a much different training approach than previous Office
version. Different in that the users requiring the most training are
the
ones who required the least for earlier versions (power users).
As I said already, force yourself to use it exclusively and see how
you
feel about a week or two from now (if it's any indication, it took me
a
month during the beta to feel familiar with the ribbon and not
wanting
to go back to menus/toolbars).
There is a lot of things somewhat hidden that will make your life
easier
using it.
Anything surrounding customization:
http://pschmid.net/blog/2006/10/18/68 (this basically lists anything
you
can adjust to your personal liking)
Then I would suggest to take a closer look by starting from this
post:
http://pschmid.net/blog/2006/10/09/58
You probably want to look at the sections "Overview of the new UI",
"Ribbon UI Elements" and "Keyboard control of the Ribbon". A lot of
the
things categorized in this post are extremely worthwhile reading
though.

Patrick Schmid [OneNote MVP]
--------------
http://pschmid.net
***
Office 2007 RTM Issues: http://pschmid.net/blog/2006/11/13/80
Office 2007 Beta 2 Technical Refresh (B2TR):
http://pschmid.net/blog/2006/09/18/43
***
Customize Office 2007: http://pschmid.net/office2007/customize
RibbonCustomizer Add-In:
http://pschmid.net/office2007/ribboncustomizer
OneNote 2007: http://pschmid.net/office2007/onenote
***
Subscribe to my Office 2007 blog: http://pschmid.net/blog/feed

I was a beta tester for 95. I was in the cheering section for
Office

XP,
expecially Outlook, and I wouldn't buy Office 2007 personally or

recommend it
to anyone who has ever used a computer.

"Suzanne S. Barnhill" wrote:

Adoption of any new Office version is always slow in corporate

America,
which has considerable investment in training custom solutions
for a

given
version, not to mention the software itself. But MS claims that

reception of
the new version is good.

--
Suzanne S. Barnhill
Microsoft MVP (Word)
Words into Type
Fairhope, Alabama USA
Word MVP FAQ site: http://word.mvps.org
Email cannot be acknowledged; please post all follow-ups to the

newsgroup so
all may benefit.

"Tom B" wrote in message
...
Then that alone close any implementation plans for office 2007.
If

a
number
of companies follow the same path as ours then the low rate

corporate
acceptance will encourage development of an application that
has

an
acceptable ROI.

Thanks for the reply and we look forward to the service pack

"Patrick Schmid [MVP]" wrote:

There is no old menu bar in Office 2007. Your employees will

have to
learn the Ribbon UI if you upgrade to 2007.

Patrick Schmid [OneNote MVP]
--------------
http://pschmid.net
***
Office 2007 RTM Issues: http://pschmid.net/blog/2006/11/13/80
Office 2007 Beta 2 Technical Refresh (B2TR):
http://pschmid.net/blog/2006/09/18/43
***
Customize Office 2007:
http://pschmid.net/office2007/customize
RibbonCustomizer Add-In:

http://pschmid.net/office2007/ribboncustomizer
OneNote 2007: http://pschmid.net/office2007/onenote
***
Subscribe to my Office 2007 blog:
http://pschmid.net/blog/feed

"Tom B" wrote in message
:

How do we turn on the old menu bar in word 2007? Without it

office
2007 will
cost far to much to implement because employee's will need
to

be
retrained.










  #15   Report Post  
Posted to microsoft.public.word.docmanagement
Tony Jollans Tony Jollans is offline
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 1,308
Default how do i enable the old menu bar

There _is_ an order of keystrokes you can learn; it may not be the same as
the one you used to use but there still is one with the only real quirk
being the QAT where the position of the icon affects the shortcut.

You no longer have the option to tailor your menu and have your own
accelerators so if you did that you have a problem. There is, though, some
built in 'legacy support' and a good many of the old default shortcuts still
work; several, however, don't and at least one does something different. I
can't imagine this support continuing on indefinitely into future releases
and you will have to bite the bullet sooner or later. Meanwhile Ctrl+Z has
already been mentioned and Alt+Backspace also still works, or Alt+E, U, ...
or ...

... you can assign Alt+E and Enter to Undo. It will require a macro to do
the customization and it will stop Alt+E working in other ways - but that
can be overcome with some more customization. The choice, for the moment, is
yours.

--
Enjoy,
Tony

"Folstaff" wrote in message
...
It probably does, it just isn't my habit.

I know I am out of step when I look at a mouse as a necessary evil, but
here
is my problem, there is no order of keystrokes that I can learn now. So my
productivity will always be limited to the speed at which I can get back
to
typing from picking up my mouse.

By and by...I read how this system is based on the statistics from Office
2003. Why would anyone do that? The majority of users were still on Office
97
2 years ago if they still aren't now. Not to mention, people like myself
who
would never, and I mean never, choose to have my clicks counted and
tracked.
Do we know the percentage of Office (not 2003, not XP, but Office) users
who
did?

"Suzanne S. Barnhill" wrote:

Ctrl+Z will also Undo, and that will still work, I believe.

--
Suzanne S. Barnhill
Microsoft MVP (Word)
Words into Type
Fairhope, Alabama USA
Word MVP FAQ site: http://word.mvps.org
Email cannot be acknowledged; please post all follow-ups to the newsgroup
so
all may benefit.

"Folstaff" wrote in message
...
I kind of expect your answer, but here it goes: Are you more productive

with
the new menu system? Are you faster? Did you time yourself? I know why

they
dumb down the interface, but why do they have to drag the install base
(at
least 80% of the users of PC's) with them?

I know the alt keys are in place, but it doesn't work the same. If I
hit
Alt-E and enter, it does nothing. In 2003, it would undo. That isn't
being
picky. I have been using Word, happily, since the first windows
version.

"Patrick Schmid [MVP]" wrote:

Some of us are still keyboard-centric (we enter/create vs. access
data).
Having to pick up the mouse every time to access what we see is

painful at
best.
The ribbon is fully accessible via the keyboard. Press and release
Alt
to get started.
In addition, all menu shortcuts (Alt+ something) that you have in
2003
work in 2007 as well. So if you know your keyboard shortcuts by hard,
just keep using them.
You should give the ribbon a chance. It is a monumental change and
you
really can only make a good call after having used it for a while
(after
all, you need to overcome its unfamiliarity). Also, I suggest you
find a
typical user in your organization and have them try it as well.
Experience shows that the users most struggling with the ribbon are
power users, because they know where their features are in the
menu/toolbar system, while beginner/intermediate users often times
end
up hunting for a feature. Most corporate users are not power users,
but
the people making the decision on whether to roll 2007 out or not
generally are. That is bound to give them a somewhat skewed view on
what
the real impact and training needs in the organization will be. I
think
2007 requires a much different training approach than previous Office
version. Different in that the users requiring the most training are
the
ones who required the least for earlier versions (power users).
As I said already, force yourself to use it exclusively and see how
you
feel about a week or two from now (if it's any indication, it took me
a
month during the beta to feel familiar with the ribbon and not
wanting
to go back to menus/toolbars).
There is a lot of things somewhat hidden that will make your life
easier
using it.
Anything surrounding customization:
http://pschmid.net/blog/2006/10/18/68 (this basically lists anything
you
can adjust to your personal liking)
Then I would suggest to take a closer look by starting from this
post:
http://pschmid.net/blog/2006/10/09/58
You probably want to look at the sections "Overview of the new UI",
"Ribbon UI Elements" and "Keyboard control of the Ribbon". A lot of
the
things categorized in this post are extremely worthwhile reading
though.

Patrick Schmid [OneNote MVP]
--------------
http://pschmid.net
***
Office 2007 RTM Issues: http://pschmid.net/blog/2006/11/13/80
Office 2007 Beta 2 Technical Refresh (B2TR):
http://pschmid.net/blog/2006/09/18/43
***
Customize Office 2007: http://pschmid.net/office2007/customize
RibbonCustomizer Add-In:
http://pschmid.net/office2007/ribboncustomizer
OneNote 2007: http://pschmid.net/office2007/onenote
***
Subscribe to my Office 2007 blog: http://pschmid.net/blog/feed

I was a beta tester for 95. I was in the cheering section for
Office

XP,
expecially Outlook, and I wouldn't buy Office 2007 personally or

recommend it
to anyone who has ever used a computer.

"Suzanne S. Barnhill" wrote:

Adoption of any new Office version is always slow in corporate

America,
which has considerable investment in training custom solutions
for a

given
version, not to mention the software itself. But MS claims that

reception of
the new version is good.

--
Suzanne S. Barnhill
Microsoft MVP (Word)
Words into Type
Fairhope, Alabama USA
Word MVP FAQ site: http://word.mvps.org
Email cannot be acknowledged; please post all follow-ups to the

newsgroup so
all may benefit.

"Tom B" wrote in message
...
Then that alone close any implementation plans for office 2007.
If

a
number
of companies follow the same path as ours then the low rate

corporate
acceptance will encourage development of an application that
has

an
acceptable ROI.

Thanks for the reply and we look forward to the service pack

"Patrick Schmid [MVP]" wrote:

There is no old menu bar in Office 2007. Your employees will

have to
learn the Ribbon UI if you upgrade to 2007.

Patrick Schmid [OneNote MVP]
--------------
http://pschmid.net
***
Office 2007 RTM Issues: http://pschmid.net/blog/2006/11/13/80
Office 2007 Beta 2 Technical Refresh (B2TR):
http://pschmid.net/blog/2006/09/18/43
***
Customize Office 2007:
http://pschmid.net/office2007/customize
RibbonCustomizer Add-In:

http://pschmid.net/office2007/ribboncustomizer
OneNote 2007: http://pschmid.net/office2007/onenote
***
Subscribe to my Office 2007 blog:
http://pschmid.net/blog/feed

"Tom B" wrote in message
:

How do we turn on the old menu bar in word 2007? Without it

office
2007 will
cost far to much to implement because employee's will need
to

be
retrained.











  #16   Report Post  
Posted to microsoft.public.word.docmanagement
Folstaff Folstaff is offline
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 6
Default how do i enable the old menu bar

The position of the icon affects the shortcut? Does that mean the hot key for
the option changes based on what is seen?

I hate customization b/c I wanted to learn where things were located. If you
customize you can't help someone else as easily. I have helped people in the
past by talking them through keystrokes over the phone. That sounds like a
lost procedure now.

"Tony Jollans" wrote:

There _is_ an order of keystrokes you can learn; it may not be the same as
the one you used to use but there still is one with the only real quirk
being the QAT where the position of the icon affects the shortcut.

You no longer have the option to tailor your menu and have your own
accelerators so if you did that you have a problem. There is, though, some
built in 'legacy support' and a good many of the old default shortcuts still
work; several, however, don't and at least one does something different. I
can't imagine this support continuing on indefinitely into future releases
and you will have to bite the bullet sooner or later. Meanwhile Ctrl+Z has
already been mentioned and Alt+Backspace also still works, or Alt+E, U, ...
or ...

... you can assign Alt+E and Enter to Undo. It will require a macro to do
the customization and it will stop Alt+E working in other ways - but that
can be overcome with some more customization. The choice, for the moment, is
yours.

--
Enjoy,
Tony

"Folstaff" wrote in message
...
It probably does, it just isn't my habit.

I know I am out of step when I look at a mouse as a necessary evil, but
here
is my problem, there is no order of keystrokes that I can learn now. So my
productivity will always be limited to the speed at which I can get back
to
typing from picking up my mouse.

By and by...I read how this system is based on the statistics from Office
2003. Why would anyone do that? The majority of users were still on Office
97
2 years ago if they still aren't now. Not to mention, people like myself
who
would never, and I mean never, choose to have my clicks counted and
tracked.
Do we know the percentage of Office (not 2003, not XP, but Office) users
who
did?

"Suzanne S. Barnhill" wrote:

Ctrl+Z will also Undo, and that will still work, I believe.

--
Suzanne S. Barnhill
Microsoft MVP (Word)
Words into Type
Fairhope, Alabama USA
Word MVP FAQ site: http://word.mvps.org
Email cannot be acknowledged; please post all follow-ups to the newsgroup
so
all may benefit.

"Folstaff" wrote in message
...
I kind of expect your answer, but here it goes: Are you more productive
with
the new menu system? Are you faster? Did you time yourself? I know why
they
dumb down the interface, but why do they have to drag the install base
(at
least 80% of the users of PC's) with them?

I know the alt keys are in place, but it doesn't work the same. If I
hit
Alt-E and enter, it does nothing. In 2003, it would undo. That isn't
being
picky. I have been using Word, happily, since the first windows
version.

"Patrick Schmid [MVP]" wrote:

Some of us are still keyboard-centric (we enter/create vs. access
data).
Having to pick up the mouse every time to access what we see is
painful at
best.
The ribbon is fully accessible via the keyboard. Press and release
Alt
to get started.
In addition, all menu shortcuts (Alt+ something) that you have in
2003
work in 2007 as well. So if you know your keyboard shortcuts by hard,
just keep using them.
You should give the ribbon a chance. It is a monumental change and
you
really can only make a good call after having used it for a while
(after
all, you need to overcome its unfamiliarity). Also, I suggest you
find a
typical user in your organization and have them try it as well.
Experience shows that the users most struggling with the ribbon are
power users, because they know where their features are in the
menu/toolbar system, while beginner/intermediate users often times
end
up hunting for a feature. Most corporate users are not power users,
but
the people making the decision on whether to roll 2007 out or not
generally are. That is bound to give them a somewhat skewed view on
what
the real impact and training needs in the organization will be. I
think
2007 requires a much different training approach than previous Office
version. Different in that the users requiring the most training are
the
ones who required the least for earlier versions (power users).
As I said already, force yourself to use it exclusively and see how
you
feel about a week or two from now (if it's any indication, it took me
a
month during the beta to feel familiar with the ribbon and not
wanting
to go back to menus/toolbars).
There is a lot of things somewhat hidden that will make your life
easier
using it.
Anything surrounding customization:
http://pschmid.net/blog/2006/10/18/68 (this basically lists anything
you
can adjust to your personal liking)
Then I would suggest to take a closer look by starting from this
post:
http://pschmid.net/blog/2006/10/09/58
You probably want to look at the sections "Overview of the new UI",
"Ribbon UI Elements" and "Keyboard control of the Ribbon". A lot of
the
things categorized in this post are extremely worthwhile reading
though.

Patrick Schmid [OneNote MVP]
--------------
http://pschmid.net
***
Office 2007 RTM Issues: http://pschmid.net/blog/2006/11/13/80
Office 2007 Beta 2 Technical Refresh (B2TR):
http://pschmid.net/blog/2006/09/18/43
***
Customize Office 2007: http://pschmid.net/office2007/customize
RibbonCustomizer Add-In:
http://pschmid.net/office2007/ribboncustomizer
OneNote 2007: http://pschmid.net/office2007/onenote
***
Subscribe to my Office 2007 blog: http://pschmid.net/blog/feed

I was a beta tester for 95. I was in the cheering section for
Office
XP,
expecially Outlook, and I wouldn't buy Office 2007 personally or
recommend it
to anyone who has ever used a computer.

"Suzanne S. Barnhill" wrote:

Adoption of any new Office version is always slow in corporate
America,
which has considerable investment in training custom solutions
for a
given
version, not to mention the software itself. But MS claims that
reception of
the new version is good.

--
Suzanne S. Barnhill
Microsoft MVP (Word)
Words into Type
Fairhope, Alabama USA
Word MVP FAQ site: http://word.mvps.org
Email cannot be acknowledged; please post all follow-ups to the
newsgroup so
all may benefit.

"Tom B" wrote in message
...
Then that alone close any implementation plans for office 2007.
If
a
number
of companies follow the same path as ours then the low rate
corporate
acceptance will encourage development of an application that
has
an
acceptable ROI.

Thanks for the reply and we look forward to the service pack

"Patrick Schmid [MVP]" wrote:

There is no old menu bar in Office 2007. Your employees will
have to
learn the Ribbon UI if you upgrade to 2007.

Patrick Schmid [OneNote MVP]
--------------
http://pschmid.net
***
Office 2007 RTM Issues: http://pschmid.net/blog/2006/11/13/80
Office 2007 Beta 2 Technical Refresh (B2TR):
http://pschmid.net/blog/2006/09/18/43
***
Customize Office 2007:
http://pschmid.net/office2007/customize
RibbonCustomizer Add-In:
http://pschmid.net/office2007/ribboncustomizer
OneNote 2007: http://pschmid.net/office2007/onenote
***
Subscribe to my Office 2007 blog:
http://pschmid.net/blog/feed

"Tom B" wrote in message
:

How do we turn on the old menu bar in word 2007? Without it
office
2007 will
cost far to much to implement because employee's will need
to
be
retrained.










  #17   Report Post  
Posted to microsoft.public.word.docmanagement
Tony Jollans Tony Jollans is offline
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 1,308
Default how do i enable the old menu bar

The position of the icon affects the shortcut? Does that mean the hot key
for
the option changes based on what is seen?


On the QAT, yes.

Alt,1 (that is Alt followed by 1 - which is not the same as Alt+1 together
although Alt+1 together will work if it is not assigned to anything else) is
the hotkey for the first icon on the QAT, Alt, 2 the second one, and so on
up to Alt,9 then Alt,0,9 then - well, I'll let you look for yourself; the
prompts for keys when you press Alt are quite handy.

Shortcuts for items on the Ribbon are, as far as I know, consistent but
exactly what appears on screen depends on what will fit depending on screen
resolution and window size.

--
Enjoy,
Tony

"Folstaff" wrote in message
...
The position of the icon affects the shortcut? Does that mean the hot key
for
the option changes based on what is seen?

I hate customization b/c I wanted to learn where things were located. If
you
customize you can't help someone else as easily. I have helped people in
the
past by talking them through keystrokes over the phone. That sounds like a
lost procedure now.

"Tony Jollans" wrote:

There _is_ an order of keystrokes you can learn; it may not be the same
as
the one you used to use but there still is one with the only real quirk
being the QAT where the position of the icon affects the shortcut.

You no longer have the option to tailor your menu and have your own
accelerators so if you did that you have a problem. There is, though,
some
built in 'legacy support' and a good many of the old default shortcuts
still
work; several, however, don't and at least one does something different.
I
can't imagine this support continuing on indefinitely into future
releases
and you will have to bite the bullet sooner or later. Meanwhile Ctrl+Z
has
already been mentioned and Alt+Backspace also still works, or Alt+E, U,
...
or ...

... you can assign Alt+E and Enter to Undo. It will require a macro to
do
the customization and it will stop Alt+E working in other ways - but that
can be overcome with some more customization. The choice, for the moment,
is
yours.

--
Enjoy,
Tony

"Folstaff" wrote in message
...
It probably does, it just isn't my habit.

I know I am out of step when I look at a mouse as a necessary evil, but
here
is my problem, there is no order of keystrokes that I can learn now. So
my
productivity will always be limited to the speed at which I can get
back
to
typing from picking up my mouse.

By and by...I read how this system is based on the statistics from
Office
2003. Why would anyone do that? The majority of users were still on
Office
97
2 years ago if they still aren't now. Not to mention, people like
myself
who
would never, and I mean never, choose to have my clicks counted and
tracked.
Do we know the percentage of Office (not 2003, not XP, but Office)
users
who
did?

"Suzanne S. Barnhill" wrote:

Ctrl+Z will also Undo, and that will still work, I believe.

--
Suzanne S. Barnhill
Microsoft MVP (Word)
Words into Type
Fairhope, Alabama USA
Word MVP FAQ site: http://word.mvps.org
Email cannot be acknowledged; please post all follow-ups to the
newsgroup
so
all may benefit.

"Folstaff" wrote in message
...
I kind of expect your answer, but here it goes: Are you more
productive
with
the new menu system? Are you faster? Did you time yourself? I know
why
they
dumb down the interface, but why do they have to drag the install
base
(at
least 80% of the users of PC's) with them?

I know the alt keys are in place, but it doesn't work the same. If I
hit
Alt-E and enter, it does nothing. In 2003, it would undo. That isn't
being
picky. I have been using Word, happily, since the first windows
version.

"Patrick Schmid [MVP]" wrote:

Some of us are still keyboard-centric (we enter/create vs.
access
data).
Having to pick up the mouse every time to access what we see is
painful at
best.
The ribbon is fully accessible via the keyboard. Press and release
Alt
to get started.
In addition, all menu shortcuts (Alt+ something) that you have in
2003
work in 2007 as well. So if you know your keyboard shortcuts by
hard,
just keep using them.
You should give the ribbon a chance. It is a monumental change and
you
really can only make a good call after having used it for a while
(after
all, you need to overcome its unfamiliarity). Also, I suggest you
find a
typical user in your organization and have them try it as well.
Experience shows that the users most struggling with the ribbon
are
power users, because they know where their features are in the
menu/toolbar system, while beginner/intermediate users often times
end
up hunting for a feature. Most corporate users are not power
users,
but
the people making the decision on whether to roll 2007 out or not
generally are. That is bound to give them a somewhat skewed view
on
what
the real impact and training needs in the organization will be. I
think
2007 requires a much different training approach than previous
Office
version. Different in that the users requiring the most training
are
the
ones who required the least for earlier versions (power users).
As I said already, force yourself to use it exclusively and see
how
you
feel about a week or two from now (if it's any indication, it took
me
a
month during the beta to feel familiar with the ribbon and not
wanting
to go back to menus/toolbars).
There is a lot of things somewhat hidden that will make your life
easier
using it.
Anything surrounding customization:
http://pschmid.net/blog/2006/10/18/68 (this basically lists
anything
you
can adjust to your personal liking)
Then I would suggest to take a closer look by starting from this
post:
http://pschmid.net/blog/2006/10/09/58
You probably want to look at the sections "Overview of the new
UI",
"Ribbon UI Elements" and "Keyboard control of the Ribbon". A lot
of
the
things categorized in this post are extremely worthwhile reading
though.

Patrick Schmid [OneNote MVP]
--------------
http://pschmid.net
***
Office 2007 RTM Issues: http://pschmid.net/blog/2006/11/13/80
Office 2007 Beta 2 Technical Refresh (B2TR):
http://pschmid.net/blog/2006/09/18/43
***
Customize Office 2007: http://pschmid.net/office2007/customize
RibbonCustomizer Add-In:
http://pschmid.net/office2007/ribboncustomizer
OneNote 2007: http://pschmid.net/office2007/onenote
***
Subscribe to my Office 2007 blog: http://pschmid.net/blog/feed

I was a beta tester for 95. I was in the cheering section for
Office
XP,
expecially Outlook, and I wouldn't buy Office 2007 personally or
recommend it
to anyone who has ever used a computer.

"Suzanne S. Barnhill" wrote:

Adoption of any new Office version is always slow in corporate
America,
which has considerable investment in training custom solutions
for a
given
version, not to mention the software itself. But MS claims
that
reception of
the new version is good.

--
Suzanne S. Barnhill
Microsoft MVP (Word)
Words into Type
Fairhope, Alabama USA
Word MVP FAQ site: http://word.mvps.org
Email cannot be acknowledged; please post all follow-ups to
the
newsgroup so
all may benefit.

"Tom B" wrote in message
...
Then that alone close any implementation plans for office
2007.
If
a
number
of companies follow the same path as ours then the low rate
corporate
acceptance will encourage development of an application that
has
an
acceptable ROI.

Thanks for the reply and we look forward to the service pack

"Patrick Schmid [MVP]" wrote:

There is no old menu bar in Office 2007. Your employees
will
have to
learn the Ribbon UI if you upgrade to 2007.

Patrick Schmid [OneNote MVP]
--------------
http://pschmid.net
***
Office 2007 RTM Issues:
http://pschmid.net/blog/2006/11/13/80
Office 2007 Beta 2 Technical Refresh (B2TR):
http://pschmid.net/blog/2006/09/18/43
***
Customize Office 2007:
http://pschmid.net/office2007/customize
RibbonCustomizer Add-In:
http://pschmid.net/office2007/ribboncustomizer
OneNote 2007: http://pschmid.net/office2007/onenote
***
Subscribe to my Office 2007 blog:
http://pschmid.net/blog/feed

"Tom B" wrote in message
:

How do we turn on the old menu bar in word 2007? Without
it
office
2007 will
cost far to much to implement because employee's will
need
to
be
retrained.











  #18   Report Post  
Posted to microsoft.public.word.docmanagement
Kevin Kevin is offline
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 85
Default how do i enable the old menu bar

In fact, Office 2007 Menu and Toolbars could be show again. Just download and
install Classic Menu for Office 2007 from
http://www.addintools.com/english/menuoffice, you will see the classic menu
and toolbars again.

  #19   Report Post  
Posted to microsoft.public.word.docmanagement
Folstaff Folstaff is offline
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 6
Default how do i enable the old menu bar

Kevin,

Thanks. I know that this is the type of addin that could really help
adoption. The screenshots looked good. The Ribbon is still hogging a good bit
of the screen, but it looks like a must have for a good bit of the install
base.

Thanks again.


"Kevin" wrote:

In fact, Office 2007 Menu and Toolbars could be show again. Just download and
install Classic Menu for Office 2007 from
http://www.addintools.com/english/menuoffice, you will see the classic menu
and toolbars again.

  #20   Report Post  
Posted to microsoft.public.word.docmanagement
JC in Houston JC in Houston is offline
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 2
Default how do i enable the old menu bar

I find the removal of the classic menu structure indicative of people who
choose to practice in theory rather than in reality. I have been a technical
writer for many years and have used both FrameMaker and Word for 99% of my
work. I know many of my comrades hate Word, but it has always worked well for
me, until now. I have converted completely over to FrameMaker. The new MS
Ribbons will not be part of my work. I hope Microsoft will realize that there
are many who prefer the old menus. The little icons look much too fluffy for
me. I think people who like pictures will love the new Office, but for tech
pros who need programs to work for them, I doubt that it will be received in
a positive light. I enjoy the MS propaganda, though. I'm sure they really
believe what they are saying.... I find the removal of the classic menu
structure indicative of people who choose to practice in theory rather than
in reality. I have been a technical writer for many years and have used both
FrameMaker and Word for 99% of my work. I know many of my comrades hate Word,
but it has always worked well for me, until now. I have converted completely
over to FrameMaker. The new MS Ribbons will not be part of my work. I hope
Microsoft will realize that there are many who prefer the old menus. The
little icons look much too fluffy for me. I think people who like pictures
will love the new Office, but for tech pros who need programs to work for
them, I doubt that it will be received in a positive light. I enjoy the MS
propaganda, though. I'm sure they really believe what they are saying....




  #21   Report Post  
Posted to microsoft.public.word.docmanagement
Suzanne S. Barnhill Suzanne S. Barnhill is offline
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 33,624
Default how do i enable the old menu bar

Worth saying twice, eh?

--
Suzanne S. Barnhill
Microsoft MVP (Word)
Words into Type
Fairhope, Alabama USA
Word MVP FAQ site: http://word.mvps.org
Email cannot be acknowledged; please post all follow-ups to the newsgroup so
all may benefit.

"JC in Houston" wrote in message
...
I find the removal of the classic menu structure indicative of people who
choose to practice in theory rather than in reality. I have been a

technical
writer for many years and have used both FrameMaker and Word for 99% of my
work. I know many of my comrades hate Word, but it has always worked well

for
me, until now. I have converted completely over to FrameMaker. The new MS
Ribbons will not be part of my work. I hope Microsoft will realize that

there
are many who prefer the old menus. The little icons look much too fluffy

for
me. I think people who like pictures will love the new Office, but for

tech
pros who need programs to work for them, I doubt that it will be received

in
a positive light. I enjoy the MS propaganda, though. I'm sure they really
believe what they are saying.... I find the removal of the classic menu
structure indicative of people who choose to practice in theory rather

than
in reality. I have been a technical writer for many years and have used

both
FrameMaker and Word for 99% of my work. I know many of my comrades hate

Word,
but it has always worked well for me, until now. I have converted

completely
over to FrameMaker. The new MS Ribbons will not be part of my work. I hope
Microsoft will realize that there are many who prefer the old menus. The
little icons look much too fluffy for me. I think people who like pictures
will love the new Office, but for tech pros who need programs to work for
them, I doubt that it will be received in a positive light. I enjoy the MS
propaganda, though. I'm sure they really believe what they are saying....



  #22   Report Post  
Posted to microsoft.public.word.docmanagement
JC in Houston JC in Houston is offline
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 2
Default how do i enable the old menu bar

yep, yep.

"Suzanne S. Barnhill" wrote:

Worth saying twice, eh?

--
Suzanne S. Barnhill
Microsoft MVP (Word)
Words into Type
Fairhope, Alabama USA
Word MVP FAQ site: http://word.mvps.org
Email cannot be acknowledged; please post all follow-ups to the newsgroup so
all may benefit.

"JC in Houston" wrote in message
...
I find the removal of the classic menu structure indicative of people who
choose to practice in theory rather than in reality. I have been a

technical
writer for many years and have used both FrameMaker and Word for 99% of my
work. I know many of my comrades hate Word, but it has always worked well

for
me, until now. I have converted completely over to FrameMaker. The new MS
Ribbons will not be part of my work. I hope Microsoft will realize that

there
are many who prefer the old menus. The little icons look much too fluffy

for
me. I think people who like pictures will love the new Office, but for

tech
pros who need programs to work for them, I doubt that it will be received

in
a positive light. I enjoy the MS propaganda, though. I'm sure they really
believe what they are saying.... I find the removal of the classic menu
structure indicative of people who choose to practice in theory rather

than
in reality. I have been a technical writer for many years and have used

both
FrameMaker and Word for 99% of my work. I know many of my comrades hate

Word,
but it has always worked well for me, until now. I have converted

completely
over to FrameMaker. The new MS Ribbons will not be part of my work. I hope
Microsoft will realize that there are many who prefer the old menus. The
little icons look much too fluffy for me. I think people who like pictures
will love the new Office, but for tech pros who need programs to work for
them, I doubt that it will be received in a positive light. I enjoy the MS
propaganda, though. I'm sure they really believe what they are saying....




  #23   Report Post  
Posted to microsoft.public.word.docmanagement
JP JP is offline
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 46
Default how do i enable the old menu bar

Why not give the user the capability to use the old menus or the ribbon? Like
you do in the operating systems (classic v.s. XP). Pretty simple, huh?
--
JP


"Folstaff" wrote:

Kevin,

Thanks. I know that this is the type of addin that could really help
adoption. The screenshots looked good. The Ribbon is still hogging a good bit
of the screen, but it looks like a must have for a good bit of the install
base.

Thanks again.


"Kevin" wrote:

In fact, Office 2007 Menu and Toolbars could be show again. Just download and
install Classic Menu for Office 2007 from
http://www.addintools.com/english/menuoffice, you will see the classic menu
and toolbars again.

  #24   Report Post  
Posted to microsoft.public.word.docmanagement
Bob Buckland ?:-\) Bob   Buckland ?:-\) is offline
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 2,073
Default how do i enable the old menu bar

Hi J.P.,

Actually, no it isn't a simple thing to combine the two of them to the point where it was reliable on a large scale deployable basis
in the time frame allowed for delivering the product. Things can get somewhat more complex within each of the Office apps as they
are not coded to a common base, but to different feature sets and methods.

===================
"JP" wrote in message ...
Why not give the user the capability to use the old menus or the ribbon? Like
you do in the operating systems (classic v.s. XP). Pretty simple, huh?
--
JP
--

Bob Buckland ?:-)
MS Office System Products MVP

*Courtesy is not expensive and can pay big dividends*


  #25   Report Post  
Posted to microsoft.public.word.docmanagement
Summer Summer is offline
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 52
Default how do i enable the old menu bar

We use and beta test RibbonCustomizer by Patrick Schmidt MVP. It offers a
free STARTER version and also offers FREE ClassicUI tabs for Word Excel and
PowerPoint as first and last tab on Ribbon menu.

It is the best interface of all three ClassicUI tabs I have tested. I use
Professional version but if you are after only ClassicUI tabs for Ribbon
they are available from Trial download and are yours permanently to use.

Read Patrick's site for further details on how to download and ClassicUI
tabs Word Excel PowerPoint.

http://pschmid.net/office2007/ribbon...er/starter.php

Janine
www.docsliveonline.com



"JP" wrote in message
...
Why not give the user the capability to use the old menus or the ribbon?
Like
you do in the operating systems (classic v.s. XP). Pretty simple, huh?
--
JP


"Folstaff" wrote:

Kevin,

Thanks. I know that this is the type of addin that could really help
adoption. The screenshots looked good. The Ribbon is still hogging a good
bit
of the screen, but it looks like a must have for a good bit of the
install
base.

Thanks again.


"Kevin" wrote:

In fact, Office 2007 Menu and Toolbars could be show again. Just
download and
install Classic Menu for Office 2007 from
http://www.addintools.com/english/menuoffice, you will see the classic
menu
and toolbars again.





  #26   Report Post  
Posted to microsoft.public.word.docmanagement
Beth Melton Beth Melton is offline
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 1,380
Default how do i enable the old menu bar

If they could provide the same functionality in the classic menus/toolbars
as they do with the Ribbon then there wouldn't have been a need to create
the Ribbon in the first place. :-)

The old UI was designed for the 80s, back when there was around only 1/4 of
the commands in the application, plus the Ribbon offers more than a list of
menus and such to choose from. While there are add-ins available that
provide the old UI, if you use an add-in instead of the Ribbon you lose out
on the new functionality - they only provide the commands that were in the
previous versions - and other than the advantages of the new file type
you're not gaining much by upgrading in the first place.

Please post all follow-up questions to the newsgroup. Requests for
assistance by email can not be acknowledged.

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Beth Melton
Microsoft Office MVP

Co-author of Word 2007 Inside Out:
http://www.microsoft.com/MSPress/boo...x#AboutTheBook

Word FAQ: http://mvps.org/word
TechTrax eZine: http://mousetrax.com/techtrax/
MVP FAQ site: http://mvps.org/

"JP" wrote in message
...
Why not give the user the capability to use the old menus or the ribbon?
Like
you do in the operating systems (classic v.s. XP). Pretty simple, huh?



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joe_btfsplk joe_btfsplk is offline
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Posts: 1
Default how do i enable the old menu bar

I whole-heartedly agree with the common sentiment amongst experienced Office
users that the new ribbon menus result in a quantum leap backward in
productivity. I have found that it takes 2 to 4 times as long to perform
common tasks in Excel when using the ribbon menus, largely due to Microsoft's
new preoccupation with forcing users to complete a series of single commands.
As an example, in Excel the simple reformatting of a line on a graph used to
be accomplished by double-clicking on the line, and adjusting all line
characteristics at once. Now, the double-clicking doesn't work, and each
individual line characteristic must be changed individually, in a number of
different windows. It is now mind-numbing. I couldn't afford the loss of
productivity when in Excel 2007, and have reverted back to Excel 2000. I am
considering doing the same for the other Office products, retaining Office
2007 solely to access files from clients who were equally foolish enough to
upgrade.
Frankly, I'm appalled by the tenor of the comments made by Microsoft's
representatives, in which users' distinct dissatisfaction with the
ineffectiveness and inefficiency of the ribbon menus is brushed off as
impatience on our part, and the fact that the classic menus were not offered
as an option in Office 2007. It appears that Microsoft has lost touch with
the vast majority of its users (and proponents), and has decided to "fix"
something that didn't need fixing: the menus. It's time for an upgrade, in
which the classic menus become available.
In the meantime, I'm warding off all my friends and colleagues from
upgrading until Microsoft presents something worth buying (developers'
opinions notwithstanding).

  #28   Report Post  
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Beth Melton Beth Melton is offline
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Posts: 1,380
Default how do i enable the old menu bar

Did you find the modeless Format dialog box? It's the one you can use to
change multiple options, each change you make can be viewed immediately
(which is great when you're not sure about the specific look you're after)
and since it's modeless you can leave it open, select another element and
modify it as well - no need to open and close dialog boxes.

I've found this method to be far more efficient than double-clicking an
element, make my changes, click OK, find out I didn't like something,
double-click the element again, make more changes, click OK and repeat the
process for each chart element I want to modify.

Please post all follow-up questions to the newsgroup. Requests for
assistance by email can not be acknowledged.

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Beth Melton
Microsoft Office MVP

Co-author of Word 2007 Inside Out:
http://www.microsoft.com/MSPress/boo...x#AboutTheBook

Word FAQ: http://mvps.org/word
TechTrax eZine: http://mousetrax.com/techtrax/
MVP FAQ site: http://mvps.org/

"joe_btfsplk" wrote in message
...

As an example, in Excel the simple reformatting of a line on a graph used
to
be accomplished by double-clicking on the line, and adjusting all line
characteristics at once. Now, the double-clicking doesn't work, and each
individual line characteristic must be changed individually, in a number
of
different windows.



  #29   Report Post  
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Suzanne S. Barnhill Suzanne S. Barnhill is offline
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Posts: 33,624
Default how do i enable the old menu bar

FWIW, it should be noted that there are no "representatives of Microsoft" in
this NG.

--
Suzanne S. Barnhill
Microsoft MVP (Word)
Words into Type
Fairhope, Alabama USA
Word MVP FAQ site: http://word.mvps.org
Email cannot be acknowledged; please post all follow-ups to the newsgroup so
all may benefit.

"joe_btfsplk" wrote in message
...
I whole-heartedly agree with the common sentiment amongst experienced

Office
users that the new ribbon menus result in a quantum leap backward in
productivity. I have found that it takes 2 to 4 times as long to perform
common tasks in Excel when using the ribbon menus, largely due to

Microsoft's
new preoccupation with forcing users to complete a series of single

commands.
As an example, in Excel the simple reformatting of a line on a graph used

to
be accomplished by double-clicking on the line, and adjusting all line
characteristics at once. Now, the double-clicking doesn't work, and each
individual line characteristic must be changed individually, in a number

of
different windows. It is now mind-numbing. I couldn't afford the loss of
productivity when in Excel 2007, and have reverted back to Excel 2000. I

am
considering doing the same for the other Office products, retaining Office
2007 solely to access files from clients who were equally foolish enough

to
upgrade.
Frankly, I'm appalled by the tenor of the comments made by Microsoft's
representatives, in which users' distinct dissatisfaction with the
ineffectiveness and inefficiency of the ribbon menus is brushed off as
impatience on our part, and the fact that the classic menus were not

offered
as an option in Office 2007. It appears that Microsoft has lost touch

with
the vast majority of its users (and proponents), and has decided to "fix"
something that didn't need fixing: the menus. It's time for an upgrade,

in
which the classic menus become available.
In the meantime, I'm warding off all my friends and colleagues from
upgrading until Microsoft presents something worth buying (developers'
opinions notwithstanding).


  #30   Report Post  
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Patrick Schmid [MVP] Patrick Schmid [MVP] is offline
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Posts: 283
Default how do i enable the old menu bar

Just to add to the comments made already here.
Take a look at http://pschmid.net/blog/2006/10/09/58
It gives you an index to the blog the Office UI Team (that created the
Ribbon) has about that new UI. There are a bunch of articles there
titled "Why the new UI" that I would suggest as reading.
As Summer already pointed out, I offer a set of Classic UI tabs that you
can use with the free edition of my add-in. It's free, because I believe
no one can do a good job with a classic UI in 2007 for all the design
reasons pointed out in the blog posts referenced above and for some
practical reasons listed in my description of the featu
http://pschmid.net/office2007/ribbon...etourpart3.php
It's also free, because my add-in is primarily for customizing the
Office 2007 ribbon, not for providing a classic UI in 2007.
There are two other vendors that offer a classic UI feature for Office
2007. Classic Menus
(http://www.addintools.com/english/me...ce/default.htm) which is
relatively similar to what I offer for free and ToolbarToggle
(http://toolbartoggle.com), which takes a bit of a different approach
(ToolbarToggle Lite is similar to what I offer).

Patrick Schmid [OneNote MVP]
--------------
http://pschmid.net
***
Outlook 2007 Performance Update: http://pschmid.net/blog/2007/04/13/105
Office 2007 RTM Issues: http://pschmid.net/blog/2006/11/13/80
***
Customize Office 2007: http://pschmid.net/office2007/customize
RibbonCustomizer Add-In: http://ribboncustomizer.com
OneNote 2007: http://pschmid.net/office2007/onenote
***
Subscribe to my Office 2007 blog: http://pschmid.net/blog/feed



"JP" wrote in message
:

Why not give the user the capability to use the old menus or the ribbon? Like
you do in the operating systems (classic v.s. XP). Pretty simple, huh?
--
JP


"Folstaff" wrote:

Kevin,

Thanks. I know that this is the type of addin that could really help
adoption. The screenshots looked good. The Ribbon is still hogging a good bit
of the screen, but it looks like a must have for a good bit of the install
base.

Thanks again.


"Kevin" wrote:

In fact, Office 2007 Menu and Toolbars could be show again. Just download and
install Classic Menu for Office 2007 from
http://www.addintools.com/english/menuoffice, you will see the classic menu
and toolbars again.




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joe_btfsplk[_2_] joe_btfsplk[_2_] is offline
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Posts: 4
Default how do i enable the old menu bar

It came as a great surprize to hear that there was a "modeless Format dialog
box" with which multiple changes could be made to Excel 2007 charts. I was
so encouraged by your comment that I immediately opened up an Excel 2007
spreadsheet & chart to explore the possibilities. Unfortunately, the new
ribbon commands didn't include any obvious reference to said functionality,
nor did the "help" function perform its duty in any combination or subset of
"modeless Format dialog box". I can only assume that this function remains
"a riddle, wrapped in a mystery, inside an enigma"; much like the rationale
for the new ribbons, despite what is stated on
http://pschmid.net/blog/2006/10/09/58 . Obviously, if an experienced user
can't find a function, there is a problem, and it doesn't lie with the user.

I had later purchased the third-party "classic" menus provided by
http://www.addintools.com/english/menuoffice after a few weeks of floudering
with Excel 2007, and while their menus are a welcome respite to the new
ribbons, they seem to provide about 90% of the previous functionality of
Excel. Reverting to an earlier version of Excel was more expedient than
continuing to deal with Excel 2007.

"Every good idea deserves a decent burial", and while I don't expect those
committed to the ribbons to kill off their invention, I'd truly appreciate
the reinstatement of the efficient functionality of the menus. If the user
has to hunt for the occassional odd menu command, that's a small price to pay
for overall effectiveness and efficiency.


"Beth Melton" wrote:

Did you find the modeless Format dialog box? It's the one you can use to
change multiple options, each change you make can be viewed immediately
(which is great when you're not sure about the specific look you're after)
and since it's modeless you can leave it open, select another element and
modify it as well - no need to open and close dialog boxes.

I've found this method to be far more efficient than double-clicking an
element, make my changes, click OK, find out I didn't like something,
double-click the element again, make more changes, click OK and repeat the
process for each chart element I want to modify.

Please post all follow-up questions to the newsgroup. Requests for
assistance by email can not be acknowledged.

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Beth Melton
Microsoft Office MVP

Co-author of Word 2007 Inside Out:
http://www.microsoft.com/MSPress/boo...x#AboutTheBook

Word FAQ: http://mvps.org/word
TechTrax eZine: http://mousetrax.com/techtrax/
MVP FAQ site: http://mvps.org/

"joe_btfsplk" wrote in message
...

As an example, in Excel the simple reformatting of a line on a graph used
to
be accomplished by double-clicking on the line, and adjusting all line
characteristics at once. Now, the double-clicking doesn't work, and each
individual line characteristic must be changed individually, in a number
of
different windows.




  #32   Report Post  
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Beth Melton Beth Melton is offline
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 1,380
Default how do i enable the old menu bar

Sorry, Joe, I should have noted to access the dialog box you need to click a
Dialog Box Launcher (small box in the bottom right corner) on the Shape
Styles Group on the Format tab, or you can use the right-click, select the
Format element command as you could in previous versions.

If you didn't discover the dialog box launchers, you'll see them in various
groups and they provide access to the dialog boxes and most of them are
identical to those from previous versions.

Please post all follow-up questions to the newsgroup. Requests for
assistance by email can not be acknowledged.

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Beth Melton
Microsoft Office MVP

Co-author of Word 2007 Inside Out:
http://www.microsoft.com/MSPress/boo...x#AboutTheBook

Word FAQ: http://mvps.org/word
TechTrax eZine: http://mousetrax.com/techtrax/
MVP FAQ site: http://mvps.org/

"joe_btfsplk" wrote in message
...
It came as a great surprize to hear that there was a "modeless Format
dialog
box" with which multiple changes could be made to Excel 2007 charts. I
was
so encouraged by your comment that I immediately opened up an Excel 2007
spreadsheet & chart to explore the possibilities. Unfortunately, the new
ribbon commands didn't include any obvious reference to said
functionality,
nor did the "help" function perform its duty in any combination or subset
of
"modeless Format dialog box". I can only assume that this function
remains
"a riddle, wrapped in a mystery, inside an enigma"; much like the
rationale
for the new ribbons, despite what is stated on
http://pschmid.net/blog/2006/10/09/58 . Obviously, if an experienced user
can't find a function, there is a problem, and it doesn't lie with the
user.

I had later purchased the third-party "classic" menus provided by
http://www.addintools.com/english/menuoffice after a few weeks of
floudering
with Excel 2007, and while their menus are a welcome respite to the new
ribbons, they seem to provide about 90% of the previous functionality of
Excel. Reverting to an earlier version of Excel was more expedient than
continuing to deal with Excel 2007.

"Every good idea deserves a decent burial", and while I don't expect those
committed to the ribbons to kill off their invention, I'd truly appreciate
the reinstatement of the efficient functionality of the menus. If the
user
has to hunt for the occassional odd menu command, that's a small price to
pay
for overall effectiveness and efficiency.


"Beth Melton" wrote:

Did you find the modeless Format dialog box? It's the one you can use to
change multiple options, each change you make can be viewed immediately
(which is great when you're not sure about the specific look you're
after)
and since it's modeless you can leave it open, select another element and
modify it as well - no need to open and close dialog boxes.

I've found this method to be far more efficient than double-clicking an
element, make my changes, click OK, find out I didn't like something,
double-click the element again, make more changes, click OK and repeat
the
process for each chart element I want to modify.

Please post all follow-up questions to the newsgroup. Requests for
assistance by email can not be acknowledged.

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Beth Melton
Microsoft Office MVP

Co-author of Word 2007 Inside Out:
http://www.microsoft.com/MSPress/boo...x#AboutTheBook

Word FAQ: http://mvps.org/word
TechTrax eZine: http://mousetrax.com/techtrax/
MVP FAQ site: http://mvps.org/

"joe_btfsplk" wrote in message
...

As an example, in Excel the simple reformatting of a line on a graph
used
to
be accomplished by double-clicking on the line, and adjusting all line
characteristics at once. Now, the double-clicking doesn't work, and
each
individual line characteristic must be changed individually, in a
number
of
different windows.






  #33   Report Post  
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joe_btfsplk[_2_] joe_btfsplk[_2_] is offline
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Posts: 4
Default how do i enable the old menu bar

Thanks: I'd accessed this same menu previously by right-clicking on the line.

Using this menu, it requires well over 20 mouse clicks to alter line
characteristics, as opposed to half that number with previous versions of
Excel. This isn't identical to previous versions by any means, and I can't
see how this an improvement. Why Microsoft didn't put all the line
characteristics (series options, marker options, marker colour, marker line
colour, marker line style, line style, line colour, shadow, 3-D format) in a
single window is a mystery to me, particularly since they're all
interrelated. Perhaps the developers were trying to maintain a pure
adherence to "Fitt's Law", in which the mouse movements are minimized, while
forgetting that the original objective was to make life easier for users. I
can't imagine anything more inefficient than doubling the number of mouse
clicks to attain the same end product. Frankly, I can't see how the ribbon
menus made it through Microsoft's approval process.

I'll continue using earlier versions of Office until Microsoft comes up with
a fix. I'll continue telling other users not to upgrade until they do,
because they can always download the trial version and get frustrated for
free.
__________________________________________________ _

"Beth Melton" wrote:

Sorry, Joe, I should have noted to access the dialog box you need to click a
Dialog Box Launcher (small box in the bottom right corner) on the Shape
Styles Group on the Format tab, or you can use the right-click, select the
Format element command as you could in previous versions.

If you didn't discover the dialog box launchers, you'll see them in various
groups and they provide access to the dialog boxes and most of them are
identical to those from previous versions.

Please post all follow-up questions to the newsgroup. Requests for
assistance by email can not be acknowledged.

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Beth Melton
Microsoft Office MVP

Co-author of Word 2007 Inside Out:
http://www.microsoft.com/MSPress/boo...x#AboutTheBook

Word FAQ: http://mvps.org/word
TechTrax eZine: http://mousetrax.com/techtrax/
MVP FAQ site: http://mvps.org/

"joe_btfsplk" wrote in message
...
It came as a great surprize to hear that there was a "modeless Format
dialog
box" with which multiple changes could be made to Excel 2007 charts. I
was
so encouraged by your comment that I immediately opened up an Excel 2007
spreadsheet & chart to explore the possibilities. Unfortunately, the new
ribbon commands didn't include any obvious reference to said
functionality,
nor did the "help" function perform its duty in any combination or subset
of
"modeless Format dialog box". I can only assume that this function
remains
"a riddle, wrapped in a mystery, inside an enigma"; much like the
rationale
for the new ribbons, despite what is stated on
http://pschmid.net/blog/2006/10/09/58 . Obviously, if an experienced user
can't find a function, there is a problem, and it doesn't lie with the
user.

I had later purchased the third-party "classic" menus provided by
http://www.addintools.com/english/menuoffice after a few weeks of
floudering
with Excel 2007, and while their menus are a welcome respite to the new
ribbons, they seem to provide about 90% of the previous functionality of
Excel. Reverting to an earlier version of Excel was more expedient than
continuing to deal with Excel 2007.

"Every good idea deserves a decent burial", and while I don't expect those
committed to the ribbons to kill off their invention, I'd truly appreciate
the reinstatement of the efficient functionality of the menus. If the
user
has to hunt for the occassional odd menu command, that's a small price to
pay
for overall effectiveness and efficiency.


"Beth Melton" wrote:

Did you find the modeless Format dialog box? It's the one you can use to
change multiple options, each change you make can be viewed immediately
(which is great when you're not sure about the specific look you're
after)
and since it's modeless you can leave it open, select another element and
modify it as well - no need to open and close dialog boxes.

I've found this method to be far more efficient than double-clicking an
element, make my changes, click OK, find out I didn't like something,
double-click the element again, make more changes, click OK and repeat
the
process for each chart element I want to modify.

Please post all follow-up questions to the newsgroup. Requests for
assistance by email can not be acknowledged.

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Beth Melton
Microsoft Office MVP

Co-author of Word 2007 Inside Out:
http://www.microsoft.com/MSPress/boo...x#AboutTheBook

Word FAQ: http://mvps.org/word
TechTrax eZine: http://mousetrax.com/techtrax/
MVP FAQ site: http://mvps.org/

"joe_btfsplk" wrote in message
...

As an example, in Excel the simple reformatting of a line on a graph
used
to
be accomplished by double-clicking on the line, and adjusting all line
characteristics at once. Now, the double-clicking doesn't work, and
each
individual line characteristic must be changed individually, in a
number
of
different windows.






  #34   Report Post  
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Beth Melton Beth Melton is offline
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Posts: 1,380
Default how do i enable the old menu bar

I guess I'm still not following what you are referring to - exactly what you
want is available. If I right-click a chart element, such as a data series
(by placing my mouse over the element and right-clicking - this works best
when the element isn't already selected), and then click Format Data Series
then I can change multiple formats in the Format Data Series dialog box,
such as Series Options, Marker Options, Marker Fill, Line Color, Line Style,
Marker Line Color, Marker Line Style, Shadow, and 3D Format. If I make a
modification I can see it instantly and I can leave the dialog box open,
select another element and make modifications.

Then, of course, if I create similar charts using the same format, I'll make
the modifications once and save them as a Chart Template (on the Design tab)
and then it's available in the Templates folder of the Change Chart Type
dialog box for other charts.

Please post all follow-up questions to the newsgroup. Requests for
assistance by email can not be acknowledged.

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Beth Melton
Microsoft Office MVP

Co-author of Word 2007 Inside Out:
http://www.microsoft.com/MSPress/boo...x#AboutTheBook

Word FAQ: http://mvps.org/word
TechTrax eZine: http://mousetrax.com/techtrax/
MVP FAQ site: http://mvps.org/

"joe_btfsplk" wrote in message
...
Thanks: I'd accessed this same menu previously by right-clicking on the
line.

Using this menu, it requires well over 20 mouse clicks to alter line
characteristics, as opposed to half that number with previous versions of
Excel. This isn't identical to previous versions by any means, and I
can't
see how this an improvement. Why Microsoft didn't put all the line
characteristics (series options, marker options, marker colour, marker
line
colour, marker line style, line style, line colour, shadow, 3-D format) in
a
single window is a mystery to me, particularly since they're all
interrelated. Perhaps the developers were trying to maintain a pure
adherence to "Fitt's Law", in which the mouse movements are minimized,
while
forgetting that the original objective was to make life easier for users.
I
can't imagine anything more inefficient than doubling the number of mouse
clicks to attain the same end product. Frankly, I can't see how the
ribbon
menus made it through Microsoft's approval process.

I'll continue using earlier versions of Office until Microsoft comes up
with
a fix. I'll continue telling other users not to upgrade until they do,
because they can always download the trial version and get frustrated for
free.
__________________________________________________ _

"Beth Melton" wrote:

Sorry, Joe, I should have noted to access the dialog box you need to
click a
Dialog Box Launcher (small box in the bottom right corner) on the Shape
Styles Group on the Format tab, or you can use the right-click, select
the
Format element command as you could in previous versions.

If you didn't discover the dialog box launchers, you'll see them in
various
groups and they provide access to the dialog boxes and most of them are
identical to those from previous versions.

Please post all follow-up questions to the newsgroup. Requests for
assistance by email can not be acknowledged.

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Beth Melton
Microsoft Office MVP

Co-author of Word 2007 Inside Out:
http://www.microsoft.com/MSPress/boo...x#AboutTheBook

Word FAQ: http://mvps.org/word
TechTrax eZine: http://mousetrax.com/techtrax/
MVP FAQ site: http://mvps.org/

"joe_btfsplk" wrote in message
...
It came as a great surprize to hear that there was a "modeless Format
dialog
box" with which multiple changes could be made to Excel 2007 charts. I
was
so encouraged by your comment that I immediately opened up an Excel
2007
spreadsheet & chart to explore the possibilities. Unfortunately, the
new
ribbon commands didn't include any obvious reference to said
functionality,
nor did the "help" function perform its duty in any combination or
subset
of
"modeless Format dialog box". I can only assume that this function
remains
"a riddle, wrapped in a mystery, inside an enigma"; much like the
rationale
for the new ribbons, despite what is stated on
http://pschmid.net/blog/2006/10/09/58 . Obviously, if an experienced
user
can't find a function, there is a problem, and it doesn't lie with the
user.

I had later purchased the third-party "classic" menus provided by
http://www.addintools.com/english/menuoffice after a few weeks of
floudering
with Excel 2007, and while their menus are a welcome respite to the new
ribbons, they seem to provide about 90% of the previous functionality
of
Excel. Reverting to an earlier version of Excel was more expedient
than
continuing to deal with Excel 2007.

"Every good idea deserves a decent burial", and while I don't expect
those
committed to the ribbons to kill off their invention, I'd truly
appreciate
the reinstatement of the efficient functionality of the menus. If the
user
has to hunt for the occassional odd menu command, that's a small price
to
pay
for overall effectiveness and efficiency.


"Beth Melton" wrote:

Did you find the modeless Format dialog box? It's the one you can use
to
change multiple options, each change you make can be viewed
immediately
(which is great when you're not sure about the specific look you're
after)
and since it's modeless you can leave it open, select another element
and
modify it as well - no need to open and close dialog boxes.

I've found this method to be far more efficient than double-clicking
an
element, make my changes, click OK, find out I didn't like something,
double-click the element again, make more changes, click OK and repeat
the
process for each chart element I want to modify.

Please post all follow-up questions to the newsgroup. Requests for
assistance by email can not be acknowledged.

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Beth Melton
Microsoft Office MVP

Co-author of Word 2007 Inside Out:
http://www.microsoft.com/MSPress/boo...x#AboutTheBook

Word FAQ: http://mvps.org/word
TechTrax eZine: http://mousetrax.com/techtrax/
MVP FAQ site: http://mvps.org/

"joe_btfsplk" wrote in message
...

As an example, in Excel the simple reformatting of a line on a graph
used
to
be accomplished by double-clicking on the line, and adjusting all
line
characteristics at once. Now, the double-clicking doesn't work, and
each
individual line characteristic must be changed individually, in a
number
of
different windows.








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leftend86 leftend86 is offline
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Posts: 1
Default how do i enable the old menu bar

Just for the record... I hate the Ribbon Bar as well. It is large and
clumsy. Although not a 100% non-mouse user, I use the mouse to get to the
tools on my toolbar when needed. I was forced to switch about 2 months ago
and still hate the Ribbon Bar, miss my tool bars and have whacked together a
poor excuse for a toolbar using the quick access feature for most
applications. A poor substitute at best.

What were they thinkin'? "Oh sure, our users won't mind clicking 2-3 extra
times to search out a function rather than having right there on a tool bar!
Nah! Not important." Somebody is out of touch!


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Posts: 4
Default how do i enable the old menu bar

(for whatever reason, my reply was lost ... here it is again)

Beth, that dialog box for Format Data Series is exactly my problem: it
consists of a cluster of nine formatting options, all of which would be more
efficiently handled in a single window with all options shown. With the
opening and closing of each individual formatting option, it now takes more
than twice as many mouse clicks to accomplish the same task ... hardy a step
forward in productivity. Furthermore, after each operation the graph redraws
itself: not bad, except with several thousand data points on each of several
lines, that process alone slows down the reformatting procedure for each and
every modification, even with ample RAM. Formerly, all modifications were
specified before the graph was redrawn. In summary, with Office 2007 I'm
spending more time to perform tedious operations, and I resent it.

Several contributors in this Discussion Group imply that those users
dissatisfied with the new ribbons are either Luddites who can't face change,
or that they only need more time with which to familiarize themselves with
the ribbons. I, for one, don't believe it; I like constructive change.
Instead, the ribbon developers should now realize that they've made a
collosal mistake in not offering menus, and reinstate them. These ribbons
are truly inefficient, and have forced me to reinstall an older version of
Excel so that I can get some work done.

"Beth Melton" wrote:

I guess I'm still not following what you are referring to - exactly what you
want is available. If I right-click a chart element, such as a data series
(by placing my mouse over the element and right-clicking - this works best
when the element isn't already selected), and then click Format Data Series
then I can change multiple formats in the Format Data Series dialog box,
such as Series Options, Marker Options, Marker Fill, Line Color, Line Style,
Marker Line Color, Marker Line Style, Shadow, and 3D Format. If I make a
modification I can see it instantly and I can leave the dialog box open,
select another element and make modifications.

Then, of course, if I create similar charts using the same format, I'll make
the modifications once and save them as a Chart Template (on the Design tab)
and then it's available in the Templates folder of the Change Chart Type
dialog box for other charts.

Please post all follow-up questions to the newsgroup. Requests for
assistance by email can not be acknowledged.

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Beth Melton
Microsoft Office MVP

Co-author of Word 2007 Inside Out:
http://www.microsoft.com/MSPress/boo...x#AboutTheBook

Word FAQ: http://mvps.org/word
TechTrax eZine: http://mousetrax.com/techtrax/
MVP FAQ site: http://mvps.org/

"joe_btfsplk" wrote in message
...
Thanks: I'd accessed this same menu previously by right-clicking on the
line.

Using this menu, it requires well over 20 mouse clicks to alter line
characteristics, as opposed to half that number with previous versions of
Excel. This isn't identical to previous versions by any means, and I
can't
see how this an improvement. Why Microsoft didn't put all the line
characteristics (series options, marker options, marker colour, marker
line
colour, marker line style, line style, line colour, shadow, 3-D format) in
a
single window is a mystery to me, particularly since they're all
interrelated. Perhaps the developers were trying to maintain a pure
adherence to "Fitt's Law", in which the mouse movements are minimized,
while
forgetting that the original objective was to make life easier for users.
I
can't imagine anything more inefficient than doubling the number of mouse
clicks to attain the same end product. Frankly, I can't see how the
ribbon
menus made it through Microsoft's approval process.

I'll continue using earlier versions of Office until Microsoft comes up
with
a fix. I'll continue telling other users not to upgrade until they do,
because they can always download the trial version and get frustrated for
free.
__________________________________________________ _

"Beth Melton" wrote:

Sorry, Joe, I should have noted to access the dialog box you need to
click a
Dialog Box Launcher (small box in the bottom right corner) on the Shape
Styles Group on the Format tab, or you can use the right-click, select
the
Format element command as you could in previous versions.

If you didn't discover the dialog box launchers, you'll see them in
various
groups and they provide access to the dialog boxes and most of them are
identical to those from previous versions.

Please post all follow-up questions to the newsgroup. Requests for
assistance by email can not be acknowledged.

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Beth Melton
Microsoft Office MVP

Co-author of Word 2007 Inside Out:
http://www.microsoft.com/MSPress/boo...x#AboutTheBook

Word FAQ: http://mvps.org/word
TechTrax eZine: http://mousetrax.com/techtrax/
MVP FAQ site: http://mvps.org/

"joe_btfsplk" wrote in message
...
It came as a great surprize to hear that there was a "modeless Format
dialog
box" with which multiple changes could be made to Excel 2007 charts. I
was
so encouraged by your comment that I immediately opened up an Excel
2007
spreadsheet & chart to explore the possibilities. Unfortunately, the
new
ribbon commands didn't include any obvious reference to said
functionality,
nor did the "help" function perform its duty in any combination or
subset
of
"modeless Format dialog box". I can only assume that this function
remains
"a riddle, wrapped in a mystery, inside an enigma"; much like the
rationale
for the new ribbons, despite what is stated on
http://pschmid.net/blog/2006/10/09/58 . Obviously, if an experienced
user
can't find a function, there is a problem, and it doesn't lie with the
user.

I had later purchased the third-party "classic" menus provided by
http://www.addintools.com/english/menuoffice after a few weeks of
floudering
with Excel 2007, and while their menus are a welcome respite to the new
ribbons, they seem to provide about 90% of the previous functionality
of
Excel. Reverting to an earlier version of Excel was more expedient
than
continuing to deal with Excel 2007.

"Every good idea deserves a decent burial", and while I don't expect
those
committed to the ribbons to kill off their invention, I'd truly
appreciate
the reinstatement of the efficient functionality of the menus. If the
user
has to hunt for the occassional odd menu command, that's a small price
to
pay
for overall effectiveness and efficiency.


"Beth Melton" wrote:

Did you find the modeless Format dialog box? It's the one you can use
to
change multiple options, each change you make can be viewed
immediately
(which is great when you're not sure about the specific look you're
after)
and since it's modeless you can leave it open, select another element
and
modify it as well - no need to open and close dialog boxes.

I've found this method to be far more efficient than double-clicking
an
element, make my changes, click OK, find out I didn't like something,
double-click the element again, make more changes, click OK and repeat
the
process for each chart element I want to modify.

Please post all follow-up questions to the newsgroup. Requests for
assistance by email can not be acknowledged.

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Beth Melton
Microsoft Office MVP

Co-author of Word 2007 Inside Out:
http://www.microsoft.com/MSPress/boo...x#AboutTheBook

Word FAQ: http://mvps.org/word
TechTrax eZine: http://mousetrax.com/techtrax/
MVP FAQ site: http://mvps.org/

"joe_btfsplk" wrote in message
...

As an example, in Excel the simple reformatting of a line on a graph
used
to
be accomplished by double-clicking on the line, and adjusting all
line
characteristics at once. Now, the double-clicking doesn't work, and
each
individual line characteristic must be changed individually, in a
number
of
different windows.









  #37   Report Post  
Posted to microsoft.public.word.docmanagement
Beth Melton Beth Melton is offline
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 1,380
Default how do i enable the old menu bar

You're right, the new dialog boxes need some work. I'm not thrilled with
them, I do think they are more efficient in most cases when it comes to
determining what you want and I like the ability to leave them open, as
opposed to opening/closing the old dialog boxes, but they are I do think
that's an area that is in dire need of improvement, if not a total revamp.
But I don't agree that the Ribbon and the dialog boxes are related. The
Ribbon is one element and was created by a different group than those who
created the dialog boxes and if they had a classic menu option you'd still
have the same dialog boxes.

That being the case, then it sounds like you dislike the new dialog boxes
and it's not really a desire for the old menu bar, right?

Regarding what may or may not be implied when someone doesn't like the
Ribbon, first, as Suzanne noted, no one here is a representative of
Microsoft and Microsoft doesn't force anyone to think one way or another. I
think what it comes down to is there is there are two types of feedback,
constructive and educated feedback, and there's destructive and uneducated
feedback. Those who start throwing around assumptions and making uneducated
statements after spending a short time with the new interface typically need
some time to adjust and they shouldn't be attempting to sway others with
their irrational assumptions.

Then there are those who can provide specific issues, based on an educated
analysis (such as in your case), and provide specific examples - that's the
type of feedback that Microsoft should hear and wants to know about. :-)

Please post all follow-up questions to the newsgroup. Requests for
assistance by email can not be acknowledged.

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Beth Melton
Microsoft Office MVP

Co-author of Word 2007 Inside Out:
http://www.microsoft.com/MSPress/boo...x#AboutTheBook

Word FAQ: http://mvps.org/word
TechTrax eZine: http://mousetrax.com/techtrax/
MVP FAQ site: http://mvps.org/

"joe_btfsplk" wrote in message
...
(for whatever reason, my reply was lost ... here it is again)

Beth, that dialog box for Format Data Series is exactly my problem: it
consists of a cluster of nine formatting options, all of which would be
more
efficiently handled in a single window with all options shown. With the
opening and closing of each individual formatting option, it now takes
more
than twice as many mouse clicks to accomplish the same task ... hardy a
step
forward in productivity. Furthermore, after each operation the graph
redraws
itself: not bad, except with several thousand data points on each of
several
lines, that process alone slows down the reformatting procedure for each
and
every modification, even with ample RAM. Formerly, all modifications
were
specified before the graph was redrawn. In summary, with Office 2007 I'm
spending more time to perform tedious operations, and I resent it.

Several contributors in this Discussion Group imply that those users
dissatisfied with the new ribbons are either Luddites who can't face
change,
or that they only need more time with which to familiarize themselves with
the ribbons. I, for one, don't believe it; I like constructive change.
Instead, the ribbon developers should now realize that they've made a
collosal mistake in not offering menus, and reinstate them. These ribbons
are truly inefficient, and have forced me to reinstall an older version of
Excel so that I can get some work done.

"Beth Melton" wrote:

I guess I'm still not following what you are referring to - exactly what
you
want is available. If I right-click a chart element, such as a data
series
(by placing my mouse over the element and right-clicking - this works
best
when the element isn't already selected), and then click Format Data
Series
then I can change multiple formats in the Format Data Series dialog box,
such as Series Options, Marker Options, Marker Fill, Line Color, Line
Style,
Marker Line Color, Marker Line Style, Shadow, and 3D Format. If I make a
modification I can see it instantly and I can leave the dialog box open,
select another element and make modifications.

Then, of course, if I create similar charts using the same format, I'll
make
the modifications once and save them as a Chart Template (on the Design
tab)
and then it's available in the Templates folder of the Change Chart Type
dialog box for other charts.

Please post all follow-up questions to the newsgroup. Requests for
assistance by email can not be acknowledged.

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Beth Melton
Microsoft Office MVP

Co-author of Word 2007 Inside Out:
http://www.microsoft.com/MSPress/boo...x#AboutTheBook

Word FAQ: http://mvps.org/word
TechTrax eZine: http://mousetrax.com/techtrax/
MVP FAQ site: http://mvps.org/

"joe_btfsplk" wrote in message
...
Thanks: I'd accessed this same menu previously by right-clicking on the
line.

Using this menu, it requires well over 20 mouse clicks to alter line
characteristics, as opposed to half that number with previous versions
of
Excel. This isn't identical to previous versions by any means, and I
can't
see how this an improvement. Why Microsoft didn't put all the line
characteristics (series options, marker options, marker colour, marker
line
colour, marker line style, line style, line colour, shadow, 3-D format)
in
a
single window is a mystery to me, particularly since they're all
interrelated. Perhaps the developers were trying to maintain a pure
adherence to "Fitt's Law", in which the mouse movements are minimized,
while
forgetting that the original objective was to make life easier for
users.
I
can't imagine anything more inefficient than doubling the number of
mouse
clicks to attain the same end product. Frankly, I can't see how the
ribbon
menus made it through Microsoft's approval process.

I'll continue using earlier versions of Office until Microsoft comes up
with
a fix. I'll continue telling other users not to upgrade until they do,
because they can always download the trial version and get frustrated
for
free.
__________________________________________________ _

"Beth Melton" wrote:

Sorry, Joe, I should have noted to access the dialog box you need to
click a
Dialog Box Launcher (small box in the bottom right corner) on the
Shape
Styles Group on the Format tab, or you can use the right-click, select
the
Format element command as you could in previous versions.

If you didn't discover the dialog box launchers, you'll see them in
various
groups and they provide access to the dialog boxes and most of them
are
identical to those from previous versions.

Please post all follow-up questions to the newsgroup. Requests for
assistance by email can not be acknowledged.

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Beth Melton
Microsoft Office MVP

Co-author of Word 2007 Inside Out:
http://www.microsoft.com/MSPress/boo...x#AboutTheBook

Word FAQ: http://mvps.org/word
TechTrax eZine: http://mousetrax.com/techtrax/
MVP FAQ site: http://mvps.org/

"joe_btfsplk" wrote in message
...
It came as a great surprize to hear that there was a "modeless
Format
dialog
box" with which multiple changes could be made to Excel 2007 charts.
I
was
so encouraged by your comment that I immediately opened up an Excel
2007
spreadsheet & chart to explore the possibilities. Unfortunately,
the
new
ribbon commands didn't include any obvious reference to said
functionality,
nor did the "help" function perform its duty in any combination or
subset
of
"modeless Format dialog box". I can only assume that this function
remains
"a riddle, wrapped in a mystery, inside an enigma"; much like the
rationale
for the new ribbons, despite what is stated on
http://pschmid.net/blog/2006/10/09/58 . Obviously, if an
experienced
user
can't find a function, there is a problem, and it doesn't lie with
the
user.

I had later purchased the third-party "classic" menus provided by
http://www.addintools.com/english/menuoffice after a few weeks of
floudering
with Excel 2007, and while their menus are a welcome respite to the
new
ribbons, they seem to provide about 90% of the previous
functionality
of
Excel. Reverting to an earlier version of Excel was more expedient
than
continuing to deal with Excel 2007.

"Every good idea deserves a decent burial", and while I don't expect
those
committed to the ribbons to kill off their invention, I'd truly
appreciate
the reinstatement of the efficient functionality of the menus. If
the
user
has to hunt for the occassional odd menu command, that's a small
price
to
pay
for overall effectiveness and efficiency.


"Beth Melton" wrote:

Did you find the modeless Format dialog box? It's the one you can
use
to
change multiple options, each change you make can be viewed
immediately
(which is great when you're not sure about the specific look you're
after)
and since it's modeless you can leave it open, select another
element
and
modify it as well - no need to open and close dialog boxes.

I've found this method to be far more efficient than
double-clicking
an
element, make my changes, click OK, find out I didn't like
something,
double-click the element again, make more changes, click OK and
repeat
the
process for each chart element I want to modify.

Please post all follow-up questions to the newsgroup. Requests for
assistance by email can not be acknowledged.

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Beth Melton
Microsoft Office MVP

Co-author of Word 2007 Inside Out:
http://www.microsoft.com/MSPress/boo...x#AboutTheBook

Word FAQ: http://mvps.org/word
TechTrax eZine: http://mousetrax.com/techtrax/
MVP FAQ site: http://mvps.org/

"joe_btfsplk" wrote in
message
...

As an example, in Excel the simple reformatting of a line on a
graph
used
to
be accomplished by double-clicking on the line, and adjusting all
line
characteristics at once. Now, the double-clicking doesn't work,
and
each
individual line characteristic must be changed individually, in a
number
of
different windows.











  #38   Report Post  
Posted to microsoft.public.word.docmanagement
Mike Starr Mike Starr is offline
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 39
Default how do i enable the old menu bar

I tend to think of it as Microsoft having welded the training wheels back on
my racing bike.

Mike
"Beth Melton" wrote in message
...
Regarding what may or may not be implied when someone doesn't like the
Ribbon, first, as Suzanne noted, no one here is a representative of
Microsoft and Microsoft doesn't force anyone to think one way or another.

I
think what it comes down to is there is there are two types of feedback,
constructive and educated feedback, and there's destructive and uneducated
feedback. Those who start throwing around assumptions and making

uneducated
statements after spending a short time with the new interface typically

need
some time to adjust and they shouldn't be attempting to sway others with
their irrational assumptions.



  #39   Report Post  
Posted to microsoft.public.word.docmanagement
Beth Melton Beth Melton is offline
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 1,380
Default how do i enable the old menu bar

Heh, at first I compared it to taking away my DeLorean and giving me a Ugo.
grin I also contacted my clients and told them not to upgrade.

I can easily admit that initially I, too, made assumptions and made
uneducated statements. But the more I learned about Office 2007 the more I
realized I was wrong. As a matter of fact, I just upgraded a client (yes, I
recanted my previous advice) so we can redo his forms and take advantage of
the new content controls.

Please post all follow-up questions to the newsgroup. Requests for
assistance by email can not be acknowledged.

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Beth Melton

"Mike Starr" wrote in message
...
I tend to think of it as Microsoft having welded the training wheels back
on
my racing bike.

Mike
"Beth Melton" wrote in message
...
Regarding what may or may not be implied when someone doesn't like the
Ribbon, first, as Suzanne noted, no one here is a representative of
Microsoft and Microsoft doesn't force anyone to think one way or another.

I
think what it comes down to is there is there are two types of feedback,
constructive and educated feedback, and there's destructive and
uneducated
feedback. Those who start throwing around assumptions and making

uneducated
statements after spending a short time with the new interface typically

need
some time to adjust and they shouldn't be attempting to sway others with
their irrational assumptions.





  #40   Report Post  
Posted to microsoft.public.word.docmanagement
J Walker J Walker is offline
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 7
Default The Arrogance of Microsoft

The Arrogance of Microsoft

This just shows how little Microsoft actually cares about its customer base.
If they had any concern at all they would have included the classic UI,
rather than forcing us to purchase it for an additional $29 from some third
party. What arrogance!

I am so sorry that I upgraded. Ive used Word for just about 20 years now
and I am an absolute fool for trusting MS. I should have done more research
before buying.

Microsoft clearly does not care about its long time customers.


"Tom B" wrote:

How do we turn on the old menu bar in word 2007? Without it office 2007 will
cost far to much to implement because employee's will need to be retrained.

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