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#1
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Indian language fonts to be included as default fonts in windows
I have developed Indian Language fonts to be used on english key board. I
have been giving them to all those who want to use them on windows to write in Indian languages such as Hindi, Marathi, Konkani, Sindhi, Bhojpuri and more free of cost. My suggestion to microsoft is that they should accept these fonts as default fonts on their windows version of today and tomorrow. This will definitely improve use of windows in Indian Homes. Mcrosoft is already havig some versions of fonts to write in these languages but they need a special driver to be installed additionally. With my fonts which are based on default keyboard driver can work like english fonts on all microsoft programmes and also on other window based programmes. I am doing it to promote use of computers in Indian homes since, english is still not the language of Indian homes. My idea is, if microsoft accepts this suggestion many more users shall benefit by this facility. Presently, I can reach only a fraction of user through my resource. I want all concerned to vote for my suggestion for the benefit of all. I shall give my fonts to those interested in trying them if they ask for them on my email IDs , , Hope to get your full support for this worthy cause. Thanks, Ashok Kothare. ---------------- This post is a suggestion for Microsoft, and Microsoft responds to the suggestions with the most votes. To vote for this suggestion, click the "I Agree" button in the message pane. If you do not see the button, follow this link to open the suggestion in the Microsoft Web-based Newsreader and then click "I Agree" in the message pane. http://www.microsoft.com/office/comm...ocmanagemen t |
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#2
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Indian language fonts to be included as default fonts in windows
The problem, Ashok, with developing Hindi (Devanagri) fonts is not that they
don't exist but that the characters on the English keyboard are not standard. I used to have over 40 different Hindi fonts developed by different people. However, there was always one common problem: none of the keys were standard. For example: the Hindi "k" or "kh" would be found on the "k" key on one key but if I changed the font, it would be found on an entirely different key! This caused many problems and every time I would have to relearn the keys. One can imagine the heartache caused if every time you changed fonts using the roman script, you would have to relearn the keyboard. I think our first step before adopting the font should be a comprehensive analysis of all Hindi characters and incorporating these onto the standard keyboard. This also includes having unique ASCII codes. I know that there are Hindi typewriters (not keyboards!) but I have not been able to get my hands on any of these. This would be the first place to start because the keys are "standard". Developing a haphazard system of assigning hindi characters to any key has many risks for the reasons above. In addition, we need to identify ALL possible characters (i.e. "ka", half "ka", visarg, ardha visarg, placing "ka" beneath some letters as in a subscript (which is common in some words), etc.. The Devanaagri (more comprehensive than Hindi) typewriter, I believe managed to capture all of these nuances and not just common symbols. I, however, commend you on your effort. Perhaps, first, we need to begin by users who know of or have a hindi typewriter to: 1. Take a picture of this keyboard (which hopefully identifies the keys) and gives a layout of how this keyboard was developed 2. Email all possible combinations of these hindi/sanskrit characters to Mr. Kothare so that we can truly develop a comprehensive and unified system of coding keys that will remaiin constant, regardless of which font a user chooses. Thanks, Vikrant. -- Vikrant "Ashok Kothare" wrote: I have developed Indian Language fonts to be used on english key board. I have been giving them to all those who want to use them on windows to write in Indian languages such as Hindi, Marathi, Konkani, Sindhi, Bhojpuri and more free of cost. My suggestion to microsoft is that they should accept these fonts as default fonts on their windows version of today and tomorrow. This will definitely improve use of windows in Indian Homes. Mcrosoft is already havig some versions of fonts to write in these languages but they need a special driver to be installed additionally. With my fonts which are based on default keyboard driver can work like english fonts on all microsoft programmes and also on other window based programmes. I am doing it to promote use of computers in Indian homes since, english is still not the language of Indian homes. My idea is, if microsoft accepts this suggestion many more users shall benefit by this facility. Presently, I can reach only a fraction of user through my resource. I want all concerned to vote for my suggestion for the benefit of all. I shall give my fonts to those interested in trying them if they ask for them on my email IDs , , Hope to get your full support for this worthy cause. Thanks, Ashok Kothare. ---------------- This post is a suggestion for Microsoft, and Microsoft responds to the suggestions with the most votes. To vote for this suggestion, click the "I Agree" button in the message pane. If you do not see the button, follow this link to open the suggestion in the Microsoft Web-based Newsreader and then click "I Agree" in the message pane. http://www.microsoft.com/office/comm...ocmanagemen t |
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#3
Posted to microsoft.public.word.docmanagement
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Indian language fonts to be included as default fonts in windows
This has nothing whatsoever to do with MSWord, but it is for exactly
the reasons described by Vikrant that Unicode was developed beginning more than 15 years ago. It is fully implemented in Windows, and by simply (yes, _simply_) enabling the IME for any of the languages using Devanagari, any computer in the world running Windows, or Mac OS X, or Linux, and probably other systems as well, will be able to read the text, with all the vowel matras and all the compound aksharas properly formed. Most, if not quite yet all, of the standard South Asian scripts are implemented. The last time I checked, Oriya was not yet available, but that may have changed by now. And once your text has been typed -- probably in the default font Tahoma, which tends to be quite ugly -- you can at will change it to any font that is similarly encoded for Unicode. It would thus be a real contribution if Ashok Kothare would assign Unicode codings to his carefully designed Devanagari fonts, so that they can be used by anyone who needs to type Sanskrit, Hindi, Marathi, etc. etc. ** And, you can set Windows to use many languages -- I personally don't know how many languages of India this has been done for yet -- as the system operating language. [I'm not at all sure why my .sig, which is normally appended to all newsgroup messages sent through google groups, doesn't appear in this newsgroup, but I am Peter T. Daniels, co-editor of *The World's Writing Systems* (Oxford UP, 1996), and I did all the typesetting in scores of scripts, using only pre-Unicode Mac fonts (a number of which I created myself -- including Oriya and Javanese) that were limited to the 255 minus 32 characters available in an ASCII font.] On Feb 18, 11:05*am, Vikrant wrote: The problem, Ashok, with developing Hindi (Devanagri) fonts is not that they don't exist but that the characters on the English keyboard are not standard. *I used to have over 40 different Hindi fonts developed by different people. However, there was always one common problem: *none of the keys were standard. *For example: the Hindi "k" or "kh" would be found on the "k" key on one key but if I changed the font, it would be found on an entirely different key! *This caused many problems and every time I would have to relearn the keys. *One can imagine the heartache caused if every time you changed fonts using the roman script, you would have to relearn the keyboard. I think our first step before adopting the font should be a comprehensive analysis of all Hindi characters and incorporating these onto the standard keyboard. *This also includes having unique ASCII codes. * *I know that there are Hindi typewriters (not keyboards!) but I have not been able to get my hands on any of these. *This would be the first place to start because the keys are "standard". *Developing a haphazard system of assigning hindi characters to any key has many risks for the reasons above. In addition, we need to identify ALL possible characters (i.e. "ka", half "ka", visarg, ardha visarg, placing "ka" beneath some letters as in a subscript (which is common in some words), etc.. *The Devanaagri (more comprehensive than Hindi) typewriter, I believe managed to capture all of these nuances and not just common symbols. *I, however, commend you on your effort. Perhaps, first, we need to begin by users who know of or have a hindi typewriter to: 1. Take a picture of this keyboard (which hopefully identifies the keys) and gives a layout of how this keyboard was developed 2. *Email all possible combinations of these hindi/sanskrit characters to Mr. Kothare so that we can truly develop a comprehensive and unified system of coding keys that will remaiin constant, regardless of which font a user chooses. * Thanks, Vikrant. -- Vikrant "Ashok Kothare" wrote: I have developed Indian Language fonts to be used on english key board. I have been giving them to all those who want to use them on windows to write in Indian languages such as Hindi, Marathi, Konkani, Sindhi, Bhojpuri and more free of cost. My suggestion to microsoft is that they should accept these fonts as default fonts on their windows version of today and tomorrow. This will definitely improve use of windows in Indian Homes. Mcrosoft is already havig some versions of fonts to write in these languages but they need a special driver to be installed additionally. With my fonts which are based on default keyboard driver can work like english fonts on all microsoft programmes and also on other window based programmes. I am doing it to promote use of computers in Indian homes since, english is still not the language of Indian homes. My idea is, if microsoft accepts this suggestion many more users shall benefit by this facility. Presently, I can reach only a fraction of user through my resource. I want all concerned to vote for my suggestion for the benefit of all. I shall give my fonts to those interested in trying them if they ask for them on my email IDs , , Hope to get your full support for this worthy cause. Thanks, Ashok Kothare. ---------------- This post is a suggestion for Microsoft, and Microsoft responds to the suggestions with the most votes. To vote for this suggestion, click the "I Agree" button in the message pane. If you do not see the button, follow this link to open the suggestion in the Microsoft Web-based Newsreader and then click "I Agree" in the message pane. http://www.microsoft.com/office/comm....mspx?mid=d329.... |
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#4
Posted to microsoft.public.word.docmanagement
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Indian language fonts to be included as default fonts in windows
Both Vikrant and grammatin have missed the issue. As for vikrant I must say
thanks for atleast admiring my effort to help writing Indian languages with english keyboard. Grammatin may not be knowing that unicode for devnagari are still not standardised. Even if tommorrow they are standardised using them may need a separate multikeyed (126 keys) keyboard. It is a big work to do all that and so at present using english unicode and english keyboard to write Indian languages is by far the best option. Grammatin says he used many fonts and mastering their each key notations was not easy. I agree to his point and that is because all the fonts he has tried are with special drivers to get large number of characters on english key board. Speciality of my fonts is that I have developed keyboard set up and that is copyrighted. Fonts made with that keyboard set up makes it possible to write almost all marathi, hindi, sindhi, konkani and also bhojpuri and such modern indian languages but for sanskrit only up to 95% can be writen. And that is not a big problem since, my expectation is that these fonts are used for modern languages and not sanskrit. By one estimate user of modern languages are 99.999% and user of sanskrit are the rest 0.001%, this may explain my point. If my suggestion is accepted a large number of users will benefit immensly since thay will get fonts in the price of the window and no extra cost. This shall make using computers all the more economical. Presently fonts of private makers are costing a price and they each have their special problems, not to mention of. I hope this satisfies friends. Ashko Kothare "Ashok Kothare" wrote: I have developed Indian Language fonts to be used on english key board. I have been giving them to all those who want to use them on windows to write in Indian languages such as Hindi, Marathi, Konkani, Sindhi, Bhojpuri and more free of cost. My suggestion to microsoft is that they should accept these fonts as default fonts on their windows version of today and tomorrow. This will definitely improve use of windows in Indian Homes. Mcrosoft is already havig some versions of fonts to write in these languages but they need a special driver to be installed additionally. With my fonts which are based on default keyboard driver can work like english fonts on all microsoft programmes and also on other window based programmes. I am doing it to promote use of computers in Indian homes since, english is still not the language of Indian homes. My idea is, if microsoft accepts this suggestion many more users shall benefit by this facility. Presently, I can reach only a fraction of user through my resource. I want all concerned to vote for my suggestion for the benefit of all. I shall give my fonts to those interested in trying them if they ask for them on my email IDs , , Hope to get your full support for this worthy cause. Thanks, Ashok Kothare. ---------------- This post is a suggestion for Microsoft, and Microsoft responds to the suggestions with the most votes. To vote for this suggestion, click the "I Agree" button in the message pane. If you do not see the button, follow this link to open the suggestion in the Microsoft Web-based Newsreader and then click "I Agree" in the message pane. http://www.microsoft.com/office/comm...ocmanagemen t |
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#5
Posted to microsoft.public.word.docmanagement
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Indian language fonts to be included as default fonts in windows
On Feb 19, 9:55*am, Ashok Kothare
wrote: Both Vikrant and grammatin have missed the issue. As for vikrant I must say thanks for atleast admiring my effort to help writing Indian languages with english keyboard. Grammatin may not be knowing that unicode for devnagari are still not standardised. If Devanagari is in Unicode (and it is), then by definition it is standardized. I happen to have the Sanskrit and Hindi IMEs activated on my computer at the moment and I have no trouble typing Sanskrit and Hindi, on my ordinary 107-key keyboard. Even if tommorrow they are standardised using them may need a separate multikeyed (126 keys) keyboard. It is a big work to do all that and so at present using english unicode and english keyboard to write Indian languages is by far the best option. Grammatin says he used many fonts and mastering their each key notations was not easy. I agree to his point and that is because all the fonts he has tried are with special drivers to get large number of characters on english key board. No; as I said, I was using a Mac, before Unicode, and there were no "font drivers" in a Mac: there were only sets of 223 glyphs (255 less 32) assigned to the 223 available slots in an ordinary font. It was in fact impossible to make all Indian fonts interconvertible, because compound aksharas are formed differently in the different scripts, but it was possible to type every one of the ten standard Indic scripts (Devanagari, Bangla, Gujarati, Gurmukhi, Oriya, Tamil, Telugu, Kannada, Malayalam, Sinhala) using the standard Mac keyboard, which is almost identical in layout and inventory to the standard PC keyboard. Speciality of my fonts is that I have developed keyboard set up and that is copyrighted. Fonts made with that keyboard set up makes it possible to write almost all marathi, hindi, sindhi, konkani and also bhojpuri and such modern indian languages but for sanskrit only up to 95% can be writen. And that is not a big problem since, my expectation is that these fonts are used for modern languages and not sanskrit. By one estimate user of modern languages are 99.999% and user of sanskrit are the rest 0.001%, this may explain my point. Then, I'm sorry to say, your product is not adequate -- the Mac fonts and keyboard software created by Ecological Linguistics in the 1980s and 1990s could handle _all_ the needs of all the languages, classical and modern. If my suggestion is accepted a large number of users will benefit immensly since thay will get fonts in the price of the window and no extra cost. This shall make using computers all the more economical. Presently fonts of private makers are costing a price and they each have their special problems, not to mention of. I hope this satisfies friends. The fonts and IMEs (what you may be referring to as "font drivers") _are_ included in the price of Windows (XP and Vista; I can't say how many years ago they were introduced). (All you need to do is go to the Control Panel called Regional and Language Options and install them. You will probably be asked to insert your Windows CD.) For most of the Indic scripts, only one font is included -- Tahoma -- and it is not particularly attractive. Thus if you, Ashok, have created good-looking fonts for Devanagari (and the other nine scripts), then you will sell many more copies if they are Unicode- and Windows-compatible than if they simply sit on top of the Latin-1 Unicode encoding (and no one will be able to share files with anyone who has not purchased your fonts, at, as you say, extra cost). "Ashok Kothare" wrote: I have developed Indian Language fonts to be used on english key board. I have been giving them to all those who want to use them on windows to write in Indian languages such as Hindi, Marathi, Konkani, Sindhi, Bhojpuri and more free of cost. My suggestion to microsoft is that they should accept these fonts as default fonts on their windows version of today and tomorrow. This will definitely improve use of windows in Indian Homes. Mcrosoft is already havig some versions of fonts to write in these languages but they need a special driver to be installed additionally. With my fonts which are based on default keyboard driver can work like english fonts on all microsoft programmes and also on other window based programmes. I am doing it to promote use of computers in Indian homes since, english is still not the language of Indian homes. My idea is, if microsoft accepts this suggestion many more users shall benefit by this facility. Presently, I can reach only a fraction of user through my resource. I want all concerned to vote for my suggestion for the benefit of all. I shall give my fonts to those interested in trying them if they ask for them on my email IDs , , Hope to get your full support for this worthy cause. Thanks, Ashok Kothare. ---------------- This post is a suggestion for Microsoft, and Microsoft responds to the suggestions with the most votes. To vote for this suggestion, click the "I Agree" button in the message pane. If you do not see the button, follow this link to open the suggestion in the Microsoft Web-based Newsreader and then click "I Agree" in the message pane. http://www.microsoft.com/office/comm...?mid=d329....- Hide quoted text - - Show quoted text - |
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#6
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Indian language fonts to be included as default fonts in windo
Dear Grammatim, we are working for windows and not mac. One more point he
missed is that my fonts are free of cost. Interesting enough my fonts work very well on both mac and linux. XP has now devnagari fonts but to activate them one need go in controll panel and activate the driver to make them functional. unless thet are supported by such drivers they cannot come and it is experienced that quite often XP fails to activate them and one is helpless. Quite often computer stops responding and one has to close the machine. Luckily Grammtim's computer is working well. But when he may experience this he will admit usefullness of my fonts! With my fonts this situation can not arrive because my fonts are based on keyboard default driver. And so thery are more relieble. Grammatim may not be aware that Indian users are not so competent to work all that. A very specialised working that XP needs is not understood by these people accrding to my experience. So to make work easy for our indian users my fonts are today found to be of much use . Grammatim, this is not just writing text but my intention is to make available fonts on internet also. Devnagari fonts with extra driver are not accepted easily by many browsers and also servers such as hotmail, goggle, yahoo etc. Since my fonts are ASCII based (english unicode) they can be easily accepted by these servers. If servers accept these fonts business in email and other internet activity shall grow in volumes. Today people can not communicate properly in english and so email activity is limited to english only but when my fonts are made available to them people will spend more time on internet and that is business. And so my suggestion is having many hidden benefits which we can not discuss on this platform. I hope my explanation clears the doubts about extra usefullnes of my fonts to windows and internet. I must thank grammtim for the lively interaction. Sadly I did not find any new point in his reaction. Actually I had sent one reply a little while ago but I felt that the reply is not sent and so this is second reply. "grammatim" wrote: On Feb 19, 9:55 am, Ashok Kothare wrote: Both Vikrant and grammatin have missed the issue. As for vikrant I must say thanks for atleast admiring my effort to help writing Indian languages with english keyboard. Grammatin may not be knowing that unicode for devnagari are still not standardised. If Devanagari is in Unicode (and it is), then by definition it is standardized. I happen to have the Sanskrit and Hindi IMEs activated on my computer at the moment and I have no trouble typing Sanskrit and Hindi, on my ordinary 107-key keyboard. Even if tommorrow they are standardised using them may need a separate multikeyed (126 keys) keyboard. It is a big work to do all that and so at present using english unicode and english keyboard to write Indian languages is by far the best option. Grammatin says he used many fonts and mastering their each key notations was not easy. I agree to his point and that is because all the fonts he has tried are with special drivers to get large number of characters on english key board. No; as I said, I was using a Mac, before Unicode, and there were no "font drivers" in a Mac: there were only sets of 223 glyphs (255 less 32) assigned to the 223 available slots in an ordinary font. It was in fact impossible to make all Indian fonts interconvertible, because compound aksharas are formed differently in the different scripts, but it was possible to type every one of the ten standard Indic scripts (Devanagari, Bangla, Gujarati, Gurmukhi, Oriya, Tamil, Telugu, Kannada, Malayalam, Sinhala) using the standard Mac keyboard, which is almost identical in layout and inventory to the standard PC keyboard. Speciality of my fonts is that I have developed keyboard set up and that is copyrighted. Fonts made with that keyboard set up makes it possible to write almost all marathi, hindi, sindhi, konkani and also bhojpuri and such modern indian languages but for sanskrit only up to 95% can be writen. And that is not a big problem since, my expectation is that these fonts are used for modern languages and not sanskrit. By one estimate user of modern languages are 99.999% and user of sanskrit are the rest 0.001%, this may explain my point. Then, I'm sorry to say, your product is not adequate -- the Mac fonts and keyboard software created by Ecological Linguistics in the 1980s and 1990s could handle _all_ the needs of all the languages, classical and modern. If my suggestion is accepted a large number of users will benefit immensly since thay will get fonts in the price of the window and no extra cost. This shall make using computers all the more economical. Presently fonts of private makers are costing a price and they each have their special problems, not to mention of. I hope this satisfies friends. The fonts and IMEs (what you may be referring to as "font drivers") _are_ included in the price of Windows (XP and Vista; I can't say how many years ago they were introduced). (All you need to do is go to the Control Panel called Regional and Language Options and install them. You will probably be asked to insert your Windows CD.) For most of the Indic scripts, only one font is included -- Tahoma -- and it is not particularly attractive. Thus if you, Ashok, have created good-looking fonts for Devanagari (and the other nine scripts), then you will sell many more copies if they are Unicode- and Windows-compatible than if they simply sit on top of the Latin-1 Unicode encoding (and no one will be able to share files with anyone who has not purchased your fonts, at, as you say, extra cost). "Ashok Kothare" wrote: I have developed Indian Language fonts to be used on english key board. I have been giving them to all those who want to use them on windows to write in Indian languages such as Hindi, Marathi, Konkani, Sindhi, Bhojpuri and more free of cost. My suggestion to microsoft is that they should accept these fonts as default fonts on their windows version of today and tomorrow. This will definitely improve use of windows in Indian Homes. Mcrosoft is already havig some versions of fonts to write in these languages but they need a special driver to be installed additionally. With my fonts which are based on default keyboard driver can work like english fonts on all microsoft programmes and also on other window based programmes. I am doing it to promote use of computers in Indian homes since, english is still not the language of Indian homes. My idea is, if microsoft accepts this suggestion many more users shall benefit by this facility. Presently, I can reach only a fraction of user through my resource. I want all concerned to vote for my suggestion for the benefit of all. I shall give my fonts to those interested in trying them if they ask for them on my email IDs , , Hope to get your full support for this worthy cause. Thanks, Ashok Kothare. ---------------- This post is a suggestion for Microsoft, and Microsoft responds to the suggestions with the most votes. To vote for this suggestion, click the "I Agree" button in the message pane. If you do not see the button, follow this link to open the suggestion in the Microsoft Web-based Newsreader and then click "I Agree" in the message pane. http://www.microsoft.com/office/comm...?mid=d329....- Hide quoted text - - Show quoted text - |
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#7
Posted to microsoft.public.word.docmanagement
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Indian language fonts to be included as default fonts in windo
On Feb 21, 6:07*am, Ashok Kothare
wrote: Dear Grammatim, we are working for windows and not mac. I was explaining to you that Windows handles this _better_ than Mac, because Unicode is fully implemented. One more point he missed is that my fonts are free of cost. Interesting enough my fonts work very well on both mac and linux. You never said -- are they TrueType? or are they PostScript? XP has now devnagari fonts but to activate them one need go in controll panel and activate the driver to make them functional. A very simple procedure that needs to be done only once. If you buy a computer in India, it presumably comes with those "drivers" already activated, because your operating system presumably is set for Hindi, Tamil, etc. unless thet are supported by such drivers they cannot come and it is experienced that quite often XP fails to activate them and one is helpless. Admittedly, I have never heard of anyone having trouble activating them, but I have not known many people who tried. Quite often computer stops responding and one has to close the machine. Luckily Grammtim's computer is working well. But when he may experience this he will admit usefullness of my fonts! With my fonts this situation can not arrive because my fonts are based on keyboard default driver. And so thery are more relieble. Grammatim may not be aware that Indian users are not so competent to work all that. Neither am I, certainly. I never used a Windows computer before September 2005 and very shortly I was familiar with typing in non- Roman scripts. Before that, I used precisely the sort of fonts you are describing, ones that sit uncomforably on top of roman-alphabet fonts, where nearly all the compound aksharas had to be typed by using keys other than the ones for the basic consonant aksharas. A very specialised working that XP needs is not understood by these people accrding to my experience. You just said that Indians are stupid! So to make work easy for our indian users my fonts are today found to be of much use . Grammatim, this is not just writing text but my intention is to make available fonts on internet also. Devnagari fonts with extra driver are not accepted easily by many browsers and also servers such as hotmail, goggle, yahoo etc. Since my fonts are ASCII based (english unicode) they can be easily accepted by these servers. If servers accept these fonts business in email and other internet activity shall grow in volumes. If they are not found on every individual's computer, then those individuals will not be able to read those websites. If the websites use Unicode-encoded characters, then anyone with a basic Windows installation (XP or Vista, at least, and probably earlier ones as well) will be able to read the websites. Today people can not communicate properly in english and so email activity is limited to english only but when my fonts are made available to them people will spend more time on internet and that is business. People happily transliterate non-roman-alphabet languages into roman alphabet for using email in any language. And so my suggestion is having many hidden benefits which we can not discuss on this platform. _None_ of this topic is appropriate on this newsgroup. I hope my explanation clears the doubts about extra usefullnes of my fonts to windows and internet. I must thank grammtim for the lively interaction. Sadly I did not find any new point in his reaction. Actually I had sent one reply a little while ago but I felt that the reply is not sent and so this is second reply. Yes, this is the first response to my posting at 11:05 am on Feb 19. "grammatim" wrote: On Feb 19, 9:55 am, Ashok Kothare wrote: Both Vikrant and grammatin have missed the issue. As for vikrant I must say thanks for atleast admiring my effort to help writing Indian languages with english keyboard. Grammatin may not be knowing that unicode for devnagari are still not standardised. If Devanagari is in Unicode (and it is), then by definition it is standardized. I happen to have the Sanskrit and Hindi IMEs activated on my computer at the moment and I have no trouble typing Sanskrit and Hindi, on my ordinary 107-key keyboard. Even if tommorrow they are standardised using them may need a separate multikeyed (126 keys) keyboard. It is a big work to do all that and so at present using english unicode and english keyboard to write Indian languages is by far the best option. Grammatin says he used many fonts and mastering their each key notations was not easy. I agree to his point and that is because all the fonts he has tried are with special drivers to get large number of characters on english key board. No; as I said, I was using a Mac, before Unicode, and there were no "font drivers" in a Mac: there were only sets of 223 glyphs (255 less 32) assigned to the 223 available slots in an ordinary font. It was in fact impossible to make all Indian fonts interconvertible, because compound aksharas are formed differently in the different scripts, but it was possible to type every one of the ten standard Indic scripts (Devanagari, Bangla, Gujarati, Gurmukhi, Oriya, Tamil, Telugu, Kannada, Malayalam, Sinhala) using the standard Mac keyboard, which is almost identical in layout and inventory to the standard PC keyboard. Speciality of my fonts is that I have developed keyboard set up and that is copyrighted.. Fonts made with that keyboard set up makes it possible to write almost all marathi, hindi, sindhi, konkani and also bhojpuri and such modern indian languages but for sanskrit only up to 95% can be writen. And that is not a big problem since, my expectation is that these fonts are used for modern languages and not sanskrit. By one estimate user of modern languages are 99.999% and user of sanskrit are the rest 0.001%, this may explain my point. Then, I'm sorry to say, your product is not adequate -- the Mac fonts and keyboard software created by Ecological Linguistics in the 1980s and 1990s could handle _all_ the needs of all the languages, classical and modern. If my suggestion is accepted a large number of users will benefit immensly since thay will get fonts in the price of the window and no extra cost.. This shall make using computers all the more economical. Presently fonts of private makers are costing a price and they each have their special problems, not to mention of. I hope this satisfies friends. The fonts and IMEs (what you may be referring to as "font drivers") _are_ included in the price of Windows (XP and Vista; I can't say how many years ago they were introduced). (All you need to do is go to the Control Panel called Regional and Language Options and install them. You will probably be asked to insert your Windows CD.) For most of the Indic scripts, only one font is included -- Tahoma -- and it is not particularly attractive. Thus if you, Ashok, have created good-looking fonts for Devanagari (and the other nine scripts), then you will sell many more copies if they are Unicode- and Windows-compatible than if they simply sit on top of the Latin-1 Unicode encoding (and no one will be able to share files with anyone who has not purchased your fonts, at, as you say, extra cost). "Ashok Kothare" wrote: I have developed Indian Language fonts to be used on english key board. I have been giving them to all those who want to use them on windows to write in Indian languages such as Hindi, Marathi, Konkani, Sindhi, Bhojpuri and more free of cost. My suggestion to microsoft is that they should accept these fonts as default fonts on their windows version of today and tomorrow. This will definitely improve use of windows in Indian Homes. Mcrosoft is already havig some versions of fonts to write in these languages but they need a special driver to be installed additionally. With my fonts which are based on default keyboard driver can work like english fonts on all microsoft programmes and also on other window based programmes. I am doing it to promote use of computers in Indian homes since, english is still not the language of Indian homes. My idea is, if microsoft accepts this suggestion many more users shall benefit by this facility. Presently, I can reach only a fraction of user through my resource. I want all concerned to vote for my suggestion for the benefit of all. I shall give my fonts to those interested in trying them if they ask for them on my email IDs , , Hope to get your full support for this worthy cause. Thanks, Ashok Kothare. ---------------- This post is a suggestion for Microsoft, and Microsoft responds to the suggestions with the most votes. To vote for this suggestion, click the "I Agree" button in the message pane. If you do not see the button, follow this link to open the suggestion in the Microsoft Web-based Newsreader and then click "I Agree" in the message pane. http://www.microsoft.com/office/comm....mspx?mid=d329... |
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#8
Posted to microsoft.public.word.docmanagement
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Indian language fonts to be included as default fonts in windo
Dear Grammatim, you have again got on wrong footing. We are talking of
windows and not mac. Interesting enough my fonts come very well on both O/S, linux and mac. Second point you have talked of, me getting money from the fonts, there again you have gone wrong. I have been giving my fonts to interested people free of cost. Even to Microsoft Corporation I want to offer them 'as user' these fonts without any cost. So Microsoft, if accept my offer they are not going to pay me for using my fonts. You may wonder then why am I doing this, well, that shall be discussed with Microsoft when time comes. You say some fonts you are using are unicode based and so you feel that Devnagri unicode is available. There again you go wrong. If you have a font making programmer (many are available on internet) you will see that all the Devnagri fonts you are using are based on unicode of English and not Devnagri! If you want to know more about unicode position of Devnagri you may open a web site called Bhashaindia.com and you will come to know that the process is still going on and no final decision is done. I, having interest in fonts, have been studying it regularly. Actually what allotments are made are such that a workable font just can not be made from that table. And so we have to depend on English unicode for some more time. All the fonts you talk about are as I said are driver based and they are not acceptable to internet browsers. Only keyboard based fonts are easily workable at present and that is why not a single browser and so server are having the fonts you have mentioned on their font file. I talked about keyboard requiring more than 105 keys because I want the keyboard to accept all devnagri fonts without a driver programme to support it. You were correct in saying that you can write using your normal English keyboard with those fonts and that is because only driver based fonts can come on English keyboard. Particularly for joint words called 'jodakshar' help of driver is a must. Then you may ask, if so, how your font work with English keyboard? To solve this problem I use segments of each breakable consonant in Devnagri. Method popularly known as type writer mode. Because of that I can get all the characters and also joining them correctly to get 'jodakshar' without any difficulty. This of course, makes writing a little slow but that is not a big problem. We have been using type writer for a long time and this was the only method used on those machines. I am sure if Microsoft accepts this offer business of Microsoft in Indian market will be greatly improved since, at present only English knowing people mainly use computers. When devnagri will be possible all local language people who are a great number will work on computers adding to the business. My main interest as I have given hint earlier is with internet use of my fonts. All the fonts you have talked of are not acceptable to internet for reasons already mentioned. And so I expect that my offer will be accepted by Microsoft and we work together. You have asked about the type of my font. My fonts are true type. Thanks for the interesting interaction I had with you, Grammatim. I hope this clears your doubts about necessity of my offer. "grammatim" wrote: On Feb 21, 6:07 am, Ashok Kothare wrote: Dear Grammatim, we are working for windows and not mac. I was explaining to you that Windows handles this _better_ than Mac, because Unicode is fully implemented. One more point he missed is that my fonts are free of cost. Interesting enough my fonts work very well on both mac and linux. You never said -- are they TrueType? or are they PostScript? XP has now devnagari fonts but to activate them one need go in controll panel and activate the driver to make them functional. A very simple procedure that needs to be done only once. If you buy a computer in India, it presumably comes with those "drivers" already activated, because your operating system presumably is set for Hindi, Tamil, etc. unless thet are supported by such drivers they cannot come and it is experienced that quite often XP fails to activate them and one is helpless. Admittedly, I have never heard of anyone having trouble activating them, but I have not known many people who tried. Quite often computer stops responding and one has to close the machine. Luckily Grammtim's computer is working well. But when he may experience this he will admit usefullness of my fonts! With my fonts this situation can not arrive because my fonts are based on keyboard default driver. And so thery are more relieble. Grammatim may not be aware that Indian users are not so competent to work all that. Neither am I, certainly. I never used a Windows computer before September 2005 and very shortly I was familiar with typing in non- Roman scripts. Before that, I used precisely the sort of fonts you are describing, ones that sit uncomforably on top of roman-alphabet fonts, where nearly all the compound aksharas had to be typed by using keys other than the ones for the basic consonant aksharas. A very specialised working that XP needs is not understood by these people accrding to my experience. You just said that Indians are stupid! So to make work easy for our indian users my fonts are today found to be of much use . Grammatim, this is not just writing text but my intention is to make available fonts on internet also. Devnagari fonts with extra driver are not accepted easily by many browsers and also servers such as hotmail, goggle, yahoo etc. Since my fonts are ASCII based (english unicode) they can be easily accepted by these servers. If servers accept these fonts business in email and other internet activity shall grow in volumes. If they are not found on every individual's computer, then those individuals will not be able to read those websites. If the websites use Unicode-encoded characters, then anyone with a basic Windows installation (XP or Vista, at least, and probably earlier ones as well) will be able to read the websites. Today people can not communicate properly in english and so email activity is limited to english only but when my fonts are made available to them people will spend more time on internet and that is business. People happily transliterate non-roman-alphabet languages into roman alphabet for using email in any language. And so my suggestion is having many hidden benefits which we can not discuss on this platform. _None_ of this topic is appropriate on this newsgroup. I hope my explanation clears the doubts about extra usefullnes of my fonts to windows and internet. I must thank grammtim for the lively interaction. Sadly I did not find any new point in his reaction. Actually I had sent one reply a little while ago but I felt that the reply is not sent and so this is second reply. Yes, this is the first response to my posting at 11:05 am on Feb 19. "grammatim" wrote: On Feb 19, 9:55 am, Ashok Kothare wrote: Both Vikrant and grammatin have missed the issue. As for vikrant I must say thanks for atleast admiring my effort to help writing Indian languages with english keyboard. Grammatin may not be knowing that unicode for devnagari are still not standardised. If Devanagari is in Unicode (and it is), then by definition it is standardized. I happen to have the Sanskrit and Hindi IMEs activated on my computer at the moment and I have no trouble typing Sanskrit and Hindi, on my ordinary 107-key keyboard. Even if tommorrow they are standardised using them may need a separate multikeyed (126 keys) keyboard. It is a big work to do all that and so at present using english unicode and english keyboard to write Indian languages is by far the best option. Grammatin says he used many fonts and mastering their each key notations was not easy. I agree to his point and that is because all the fonts he has tried are with special drivers to get large number of characters on english key board. No; as I said, I was using a Mac, before Unicode, and there were no "font drivers" in a Mac: there were only sets of 223 glyphs (255 less 32) assigned to the 223 available slots in an ordinary font. It was in fact impossible to make all Indian fonts interconvertible, because compound aksharas are formed differently in the different scripts, but it was possible to type every one of the ten standard Indic scripts (Devanagari, Bangla, Gujarati, Gurmukhi, Oriya, Tamil, Telugu, Kannada, Malayalam, Sinhala) using the standard Mac keyboard, which is almost identical in layout and inventory to the standard PC keyboard. Speciality of my fonts is that I have developed keyboard set up and that is copyrighted.. Fonts made with that keyboard set up makes it possible to write almost all marathi, hindi, sindhi, konkani and also bhojpuri and such modern indian languages but for sanskrit only up to 95% can be writen. And that is not a big problem since, my expectation is that these fonts are used for modern languages and not sanskrit. By one estimate user of modern languages are 99.999% and user of sanskrit are the rest 0.001%, this may explain my point. Then, I'm sorry to say, your product is not adequate -- the Mac fonts and keyboard software created by Ecological Linguistics in the 1980s and 1990s could handle _all_ the needs of all the languages, classical and modern. If my suggestion is accepted a large number of users will benefit immensly since thay will get fonts in the price of the window and no extra cost.. This shall make using computers all the more economical. Presently fonts of private makers are costing a price and they each have their special problems, not to mention of. I hope this satisfies friends. The fonts and IMEs (what you may be referring to as "font drivers") _are_ included in the price of Windows (XP and Vista; I can't say how many years ago they were introduced). (All you need to do is go to the Control Panel called Regional and Language Options and install them. You will probably be asked to insert your Windows CD.) For most of the Indic scripts, only one font is included -- Tahoma -- and it is not particularly attractive. Thus if you, Ashok, have created good-looking fonts for Devanagari (and the other nine scripts), then you will sell many more copies if they are Unicode- and Windows-compatible than if they simply sit on top of the Latin-1 Unicode encoding (and no one will be able to share files with anyone who has not purchased your fonts, at, as you say, extra cost). "Ashok Kothare" wrote: I have developed Indian Language fonts to be used on english key board. I have been giving them to all those who want to use them on windows to write in Indian languages such as Hindi, Marathi, Konkani, Sindhi, Bhojpuri and more free of cost. My suggestion to microsoft is that they should accept these fonts as default fonts on their windows version of today and tomorrow. This will definitely improve use of windows in Indian Homes. Mcrosoft is already havig some versions of fonts to write in these languages but they need a special driver to be installed additionally. With my fonts which are based on default keyboard driver can work like english fonts on all microsoft programmes and also on other window based programmes. I am doing it to promote use of computers in Indian homes since, english is still not the language of Indian homes. My idea is, if microsoft accepts this suggestion many more users shall benefit by this facility. Presently, I can reach only a fraction of user through my resource. I want all concerned to vote for my suggestion for the benefit of all. I shall give my fonts to those interested in trying them if they ask for them on my email IDs , , Hope to get your full support for this worthy cause. Thanks, Ashok Kothare. ---------------- This post is a suggestion for Microsoft, and Microsoft responds to the suggestions with the most votes. To vote for this suggestion, click the "I Agree" button in the message pane. If you do not see the button, follow this link to open the suggestion in the Microsoft Web-based Newsreader and then click "I Agree" in the message pane. http://www.microsoft.com/office/comm....mspx?mid=d329... |
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#9
Posted to microsoft.public.word.docmanagement
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Indian language fonts to be included as default fonts in windo
On Feb 21, 11:53*am, Ashok Kothare
wrote: Dear Grammatim, you have again got on wrong footing. We are talking of windows and not mac. Yes. I have been telling you that Windows handles this _better_ than Mac. Interesting enough my fonts come very well on both O/S, linux and mac. Second point you have talked of, me getting money from the fonts, there again you have gone wrong. I have been giving my fonts to interested people free of cost. Even to Microsoft Corporation I want to offer them 'as user' these fonts without any cost. So Microsoft, if accept my offer they are not going to pay me for using my fonts. You may wonder then why am I doing this, well, that shall be discussed with Microsoft when time comes. You say some fonts you are using are unicode based and so you feel that Devnagri unicode is available. There again you go wrong. If you have a font making programmer (many are available on internet) you will see that all the Devnagri fonts you are using are based on unicode of English and not Devnagri! You are simply wrong. Open the "Insert Symbol" panel in Word, set the font to Tahoma and the encoding to Unicode, and you will see a drop- down menu listing the character ranges available in the font. You will see a variety of Indic scripts included there. If you double-click on any of the Indic characters included, it will be inserted into your document, and if you try to change its font to some "English"-only font, it will not change. It is clear from what you write below that you do not know how to use the resources built into every Windows computer. Since you are not willing to learn, there is no point in attempting to communicate with you further. And the site you should be visiting is called unicode.org. I happen to own the printed book of the Unicode Standard v. 1.0, and all the way back in 1991 it included all nine Indic scripts of India, fully implemented. (Sinhala was not included, perhaps because India had better connections with the computing world than Sri Lanka.) If you want to know more about unicode position of Devnagri you may open a web site called Bhashaindia.com and you will come to know that the process is still going on and no final decision is done. I, having interest in fonts, have been studying it regularly. Actually what allotments are made are such that a workable font just can not be made from that table. And so we have to depend on English unicode for some more time. All the fonts you talk about are as I said are driver based and they are not acceptable to internet browsers. Only keyboard based fonts are easily workable at present and that is why not a single browser and so server are having the fonts you have mentioned on their font file. I talked about keyboard requiring more than 105 keys because I want the keyboard to accept all devnagri fonts without a driver programme to support it. You were correct in saying that you can write using your normal English keyboard with those fonts and that is because only driver based fonts can come on English keyboard. Particularly for joint words called 'jodakshar' help of driver is a must. Then you may ask, if so, how your font work with English keyboard? To solve this problem I use segments of each breakable consonant in Devnagri. Method popularly known as type writer mode. Because of that I can get all the characters and also joining them correctly to get 'jodakshar' without any difficulty. This of course, makes writing a little slow but that is not a big problem. We have been using type writer for a long time and this was the only method used on those machines. I am sure if Microsoft accepts this offer business of Microsoft in Indian market will be greatly improved since, at present only English knowing people mainly use computers. When devnagri will be possible all local language people who are a great number will work on computers adding to the business. My main interest as I have given hint earlier is with internet use of my fonts. All the fonts you have talked of are not acceptable to internet for reasons already mentioned. And so I expect that my offer will be accepted by Microsoft and we work together. You have asked about the type of my font. My fonts are true type. Thanks for the interesting interaction I had with you, Grammatim. I hope this clears your doubts about necessity of my offer. "grammatim" wrote: On Feb 21, 6:07 am, Ashok Kothare wrote: Dear Grammatim, we are working for windows and not mac. I was explaining to you that Windows handles this _better_ than Mac, because Unicode is fully implemented. One more point he missed is that my fonts are free of cost. Interesting enough my fonts work very well on both mac and linux. You never said -- are they TrueType? or are they PostScript? XP has now devnagari fonts but to activate them one need go in controll panel and activate the driver to make them functional. A very simple procedure that needs to be done only once. If you buy a computer in India, it presumably comes with those "drivers" already activated, because your operating system presumably is set for Hindi, Tamil, etc. unless thet are supported by such drivers they cannot come and it is experienced that quite often XP fails to activate them and one is helpless. Admittedly, I have never heard of anyone having trouble activating them, but I have not known many people who tried. Quite often computer stops responding and one has to close the machine. Luckily Grammtim's computer is working well. But when he may experience this he will admit usefullness of my fonts! With my fonts this situation can not arrive because my fonts are based on keyboard default driver. And so thery are more relieble. Grammatim may not be aware that Indian users are not so competent to work all that. Neither am I, certainly. I never used a Windows computer before September 2005 and very shortly I was familiar with typing in non- Roman scripts. Before that, I used precisely the sort of fonts you are describing, ones that sit uncomforably on top of roman-alphabet fonts, where nearly all the compound aksharas had to be typed by using keys other than the ones for the basic consonant aksharas. A very specialised working that XP needs is not understood by these people accrding to my experience. You just said that Indians are stupid! So to make work easy for our indian users my fonts are today found to be of much use . Grammatim, this is not just writing text but my intention is to make available fonts on internet also. Devnagari fonts with extra driver are not accepted easily by many browsers and also servers such as hotmail, goggle, yahoo etc. Since my fonts are ASCII based (english unicode) they can be easily accepted by these servers. If servers accept these fonts business in email and other internet activity shall grow in volumes. If they are not found on every individual's computer, then those individuals will not be able to read those websites. If the websites use Unicode-encoded characters, then anyone with a basic Windows installation (XP or Vista, at least, and probably earlier ones as well) will be able to read the websites. Today people can not communicate properly in english and so email activity is limited to english only but when my fonts are made available to them people will spend more time on internet and that is business. People happily transliterate non-roman-alphabet languages into roman alphabet for using email in any language. And so my suggestion is having many hidden benefits which we can not discuss on this platform. _None_ of this topic is appropriate on this newsgroup. I hope my explanation clears the doubts about extra usefullnes of my fonts to windows and internet. I must thank grammtim for the lively interaction. Sadly I did not find any new point in his reaction. Actually I had sent one reply a little while ago but I felt that the reply is not sent and so this is second reply. Yes, this is the first response to my posting at 11:05 am on Feb 19. "grammatim" wrote: On Feb 19, 9:55 am, Ashok Kothare wrote: Both Vikrant and grammatin have missed the issue. As for vikrant I must say thanks for atleast admiring my effort to help writing Indian languages with english keyboard. Grammatin may not be knowing that unicode for devnagari are still not standardised. If Devanagari is in Unicode (and it is), then by definition it is standardized. I happen to have the Sanskrit and Hindi IMEs activated on my computer at the moment and I have no trouble typing Sanskrit and Hindi, on my ordinary 107-key keyboard. Even if tommorrow they are standardised using them may need a separate multikeyed (126 keys) keyboard. It is a big work to do all that and so at present using english unicode and english keyboard to write Indian languages is by far the best option. Grammatin says he used many fonts and mastering their each key notations was not easy. I agree to his point and that is because all the fonts he has tried are with special drivers to get large number of characters on english key board. No; as I said, I was using a Mac, before Unicode, and there were no "font drivers" in a Mac: there were only sets of 223 glyphs (255 less 32) assigned to the 223 available slots in an ordinary font. It was in fact impossible to make all Indian fonts interconvertible, because compound aksharas are formed differently in the different scripts, but it was possible to type every one of the ten standard Indic scripts (Devanagari, Bangla, Gujarati, Gurmukhi, Oriya, Tamil, Telugu, Kannada, Malayalam, Sinhala) using the standard Mac keyboard, which is almost identical in layout and inventory to the standard PC keyboard.. Speciality of my fonts is that I have developed keyboard set up and that is copyrighted.. Fonts made with that keyboard set up makes it possible to write almost all marathi, hindi, sindhi, konkani and also bhojpuri and such modern indian languages but for sanskrit only up to 95% can be writen. And that is not a big problem since, my expectation is that these fonts are used for modern languages and not sanskrit. By one estimate user of modern languages are 99.999% and user of sanskrit are the rest 0.001%, this may explain my point. Then, I'm sorry to say, your product is not adequate -- the Mac fonts and keyboard software created by Ecological Linguistics in the 1980s and 1990s could handle _all_ the needs of all the languages, classical and modern. ... read more »- Hide quoted text - - Show quoted text - |
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#10
Posted to microsoft.public.word.docmanagement
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Indian language fonts to be included as default fonts in windo
FWIW, I don't see Indic characters in Tahoma, but I do see them in Arial
Unicode MS. -- Suzanne S. Barnhill Microsoft MVP (Word) Words into Type Fairhope, Alabama USA "grammatim" wrote in message ... On Feb 21, 11:53 am, Ashok Kothare wrote: Dear Grammatim, you have again got on wrong footing. We are talking of windows and not mac. Yes. I have been telling you that Windows handles this _better_ than Mac. Interesting enough my fonts come very well on both O/S, linux and mac. Second point you have talked of, me getting money from the fonts, there again you have gone wrong. I have been giving my fonts to interested people free of cost. Even to Microsoft Corporation I want to offer them 'as user' these fonts without any cost. So Microsoft, if accept my offer they are not going to pay me for using my fonts. You may wonder then why am I doing this, well, that shall be discussed with Microsoft when time comes. You say some fonts you are using are unicode based and so you feel that Devnagri unicode is available. There again you go wrong. If you have a font making programmer (many are available on internet) you will see that all the Devnagri fonts you are using are based on unicode of English and not Devnagri! You are simply wrong. Open the "Insert Symbol" panel in Word, set the font to Tahoma and the encoding to Unicode, and you will see a drop- down menu listing the character ranges available in the font. You will see a variety of Indic scripts included there. If you double-click on any of the Indic characters included, it will be inserted into your document, and if you try to change its font to some "English"-only font, it will not change. It is clear from what you write below that you do not know how to use the resources built into every Windows computer. Since you are not willing to learn, there is no point in attempting to communicate with you further. And the site you should be visiting is called unicode.org. I happen to own the printed book of the Unicode Standard v. 1.0, and all the way back in 1991 it included all nine Indic scripts of India, fully implemented. (Sinhala was not included, perhaps because India had better connections with the computing world than Sri Lanka.) If you want to know more about unicode position of Devnagri you may open a web site called Bhashaindia.com and you will come to know that the process is still going on and no final decision is done. I, having interest in fonts, have been studying it regularly. Actually what allotments are made are such that a workable font just can not be made from that table. And so we have to depend on English unicode for some more time. All the fonts you talk about are as I said are driver based and they are not acceptable to internet browsers. Only keyboard based fonts are easily workable at present and that is why not a single browser and so server are having the fonts you have mentioned on their font file. I talked about keyboard requiring more than 105 keys because I want the keyboard to accept all devnagri fonts without a driver programme to support it. You were correct in saying that you can write using your normal English keyboard with those fonts and that is because only driver based fonts can come on English keyboard. Particularly for joint words called 'jodakshar' help of driver is a must. Then you may ask, if so, how your font work with English keyboard? To solve this problem I use segments of each breakable consonant in Devnagri. Method popularly known as type writer mode. Because of that I can get all the characters and also joining them correctly to get 'jodakshar' without any difficulty. This of course, makes writing a little slow but that is not a big problem. We have been using type writer for a long time and this was the only method used on those machines. I am sure if Microsoft accepts this offer business of Microsoft in Indian market will be greatly improved since, at present only English knowing people mainly use computers. When devnagri will be possible all local language people who are a great number will work on computers adding to the business. My main interest as I have given hint earlier is with internet use of my fonts. All the fonts you have talked of are not acceptable to internet for reasons already mentioned. And so I expect that my offer will be accepted by Microsoft and we work together. You have asked about the type of my font. My fonts are true type. Thanks for the interesting interaction I had with you, Grammatim. I hope this clears your doubts about necessity of my offer. "grammatim" wrote: On Feb 21, 6:07 am, Ashok Kothare wrote: Dear Grammatim, we are working for windows and not mac. I was explaining to you that Windows handles this _better_ than Mac, because Unicode is fully implemented. One more point he missed is that my fonts are free of cost. Interesting enough my fonts work very well on both mac and linux. You never said -- are they TrueType? or are they PostScript? XP has now devnagari fonts but to activate them one need go in controll panel and activate the driver to make them functional. A very simple procedure that needs to be done only once. If you buy a computer in India, it presumably comes with those "drivers" already activated, because your operating system presumably is set for Hindi, Tamil, etc. unless thet are supported by such drivers they cannot come and it is experienced that quite often XP fails to activate them and one is helpless. Admittedly, I have never heard of anyone having trouble activating them, but I have not known many people who tried. Quite often computer stops responding and one has to close the machine. Luckily Grammtim's computer is working well. But when he may experience this he will admit usefullness of my fonts! With my fonts this situation can not arrive because my fonts are based on keyboard default driver. And so thery are more relieble. Grammatim may not be aware that Indian users are not so competent to work all that. Neither am I, certainly. I never used a Windows computer before September 2005 and very shortly I was familiar with typing in non- Roman scripts. Before that, I used precisely the sort of fonts you are describing, ones that sit uncomforably on top of roman-alphabet fonts, where nearly all the compound aksharas had to be typed by using keys other than the ones for the basic consonant aksharas. A very specialised working that XP needs is not understood by these people accrding to my experience. You just said that Indians are stupid! So to make work easy for our indian users my fonts are today found to be of much use . Grammatim, this is not just writing text but my intention is to make available fonts on internet also. Devnagari fonts with extra driver are not accepted easily by many browsers and also servers such as hotmail, goggle, yahoo etc. Since my fonts are ASCII based (english unicode) they can be easily accepted by these servers. If servers accept these fonts business in email and other internet activity shall grow in volumes. If they are not found on every individual's computer, then those individuals will not be able to read those websites. If the websites use Unicode-encoded characters, then anyone with a basic Windows installation (XP or Vista, at least, and probably earlier ones as well) will be able to read the websites. Today people can not communicate properly in english and so email activity is limited to english only but when my fonts are made available to them people will spend more time on internet and that is business. People happily transliterate non-roman-alphabet languages into roman alphabet for using email in any language. And so my suggestion is having many hidden benefits which we can not discuss on this platform. _None_ of this topic is appropriate on this newsgroup. I hope my explanation clears the doubts about extra usefullnes of my fonts to windows and internet. I must thank grammtim for the lively interaction. Sadly I did not find any new point in his reaction. Actually I had sent one reply a little while ago but I felt that the reply is not sent and so this is second reply. Yes, this is the first response to my posting at 11:05 am on Feb 19. "grammatim" wrote: On Feb 19, 9:55 am, Ashok Kothare wrote: Both Vikrant and grammatin have missed the issue. As for vikrant I must say thanks for atleast admiring my effort to help writing Indian languages with english keyboard. Grammatin may not be knowing that unicode for devnagari are still not standardised. If Devanagari is in Unicode (and it is), then by definition it is standardized. I happen to have the Sanskrit and Hindi IMEs activated on my computer at the moment and I have no trouble typing Sanskrit and Hindi, on my ordinary 107-key keyboard. Even if tommorrow they are standardised using them may need a separate multikeyed (126 keys) keyboard. It is a big work to do all that and so at present using english unicode and english keyboard to write Indian languages is by far the best option. Grammatin says he used many fonts and mastering their each key notations was not easy. I agree to his point and that is because all the fonts he has tried are with special drivers to get large number of characters on english key board. No; as I said, I was using a Mac, before Unicode, and there were no "font drivers" in a Mac: there were only sets of 223 glyphs (255 less 32) assigned to the 223 available slots in an ordinary font. It was in fact impossible to make all Indian fonts interconvertible, because compound aksharas are formed differently in the different scripts, but it was possible to type every one of the ten standard Indic scripts (Devanagari, Bangla, Gujarati, Gurmukhi, Oriya, Tamil, Telugu, Kannada, Malayalam, Sinhala) using the standard Mac keyboard, which is almost identical in layout and inventory to the standard PC keyboard. Speciality of my fonts is that I have developed keyboard set up and that is copyrighted.. Fonts made with that keyboard set up makes it possible to write almost all marathi, hindi, sindhi, konkani and also bhojpuri and such modern indian languages but for sanskrit only up to 95% can be writen. And that is not a big problem since, my expectation is that these fonts are used for modern languages and not sanskrit. By one estimate user of modern languages are 99.999% and user of sanskrit are the rest 0.001%, this may explain my point. Then, I'm sorry to say, your product is not adequate -- the Mac fonts and keyboard software created by Ecological Linguistics in the 1980s and 1990s could handle _all_ the needs of all the languages, classical and modern. ... read more »- Hide quoted text - - Show quoted text - |
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#12
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Indian language fonts to be included as default fonts in windows
I'm not sure how you made your offer to Microsoft but if the only method you
used is the 'Suggestion to Microsoft' post type in the newsgroup then unfortunately it will likely fall on deaf ears. Microsoft doesn't monitor these newsgroups or the Suggestion posts. For example, if you filter this group for "Suggestions with Microsoft Response" you'll see exactly 1 Microsoft response to a suggestion. That was about 3 years ago. You may also want to note the response was around 10 months after the initial suggestion. Oh, and did I mention the post was actually a test for suggestions to see if MS would actually respond? Interestingly, the response was posted not long after several of us drew attention to the fact MS wasn't responding to Suggestion posts in the newsgroup. g ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Beth Melton "Ashok Kothare" wrote in message ... My offer to Microsoft is actually to remedy this problem. Supposing Microsoft accept my offer and actually include my fonts with my keyboard set up then users will not bother to go for other fonts and rest with my fonts. |
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#13
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Indian language fonts to be included as default fonts in windo
I appreciate your advice Beth Melton. If this is not the way to offer my
fonts to MS then what is the right method of approach to MS? Can you suggest. Thanks for the advice. "Beth Melton" wrote: I'm not sure how you made your offer to Microsoft but if the only method you used is the 'Suggestion to Microsoft' post type in the newsgroup then unfortunately it will likely fall on deaf ears. Microsoft doesn't monitor these newsgroups or the Suggestion posts. For example, if you filter this group for "Suggestions with Microsoft Response" you'll see exactly 1 Microsoft response to a suggestion. That was about 3 years ago. You may also want to note the response was around 10 months after the initial suggestion. Oh, and did I mention the post was actually a test for suggestions to see if MS would actually respond? Interestingly, the response was posted not long after several of us drew attention to the fact MS wasn't responding to Suggestion posts in the newsgroup. g ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Beth Melton "Ashok Kothare" wrote in message ... My offer to Microsoft is actually to remedy this problem. Supposing Microsoft accept my offer and actually include my fonts with my keyboard set up then users will not bother to go for other fonts and rest with my fonts. |
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#14
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Indian language fonts to be included as default fonts in windo
Dear Vikrant,
Grammatim is a little impatient on these matters. So I now prefer to talk to you. Your point that we do not have standardised keyboard set up is very true. If you remember about 50 years ago in USA the same condition prevailed. American government passed an act of ASCII and standardised the keyboard. It was possible to that govenment because all computer masters such as IBM, Microsoft, Adobe, apple and more were americans. Today we have similar situation for Indian languages. Our government has also passed similar act called ISCII but that is not followed because, 1) indian market is not big enough to bother about our problem, 2) we prefer to work with english than any other of our languages. 3) amongst indians devnagri is used by atleast 6 different languages and the character requirements of each is different. I know Malayalum and Tamil unicode is standardized and that was possible because both scripts are used by single language each, 4) each year atleast 2 to 3 more font makers come in market to sell their fonts adding to the number of fonts, 5) each font is copyrighted and so nobody can copy other's keyboard set up for legal reasons. My offer to Microsoft is actually to remedy this problem. Supposing Microsoft accept my offer and actually include my fonts with my keyboard set up then users will not bother to go for other fonts and rest with my fonts. This shall in return bring about a type of standardization of key board. Second advantage will be that, once devnagri fonts are accepted as default fonts always readily available on the computer, non-english users shall immerge in great numbers adding to the business of computers. According to my information Microsoft has devnagri fonts by arrangement with some indian font maker and that is at a premium price adding to the cost of the software. Again that keyboard setup is copyrighted and so no body can copy that set up and design fonts. Here my offer comes with advantage. How? Let me explain, My fonts are available free of cost to Microsoft and so if they accept them they have nothing to loose but the users benefit immensly. In case some font maker wants to use my keyboard set up to make his fonts he can do it by paying to me the royalty charges. In this process more and more fonts with great many varieties will be available to users. As you have said you got 40 fonts in devnagri I request you to ask for my fonts on my email and you will get them by reply free of cost. Initially I started doing this because I want non-english people to take to computers in a big way. Actually I am a hobbist and making fonts is not my busines but hobby and so I can do this, which profesional font makers can not do at all. I have seen that fonts made by these professionals are not workable on all window versions. As new versions come old fonts are discarded and users have to buy again next version of that font. This makes using these fonts very painful and discourages users. My fonts being keyboard default driver based can come on all versions of windows present and future. This prospect has already made my fonts popular in users. Grammatim suggests to use insert font from word. This works so long as you are working in word. If you want to work in photo paint, page maker, photoshop and such different programmes these fonts do not work. With my fonts user can work freely in all the programmes workable on windows and so they have an advantage above those fonts. I thing it is immaterial whether a font is ascii based or unicode based so long as it works on the machine properly. Insistance for unicode fonts have in some cases caused problems with keyboards. Not all keyboards respond well for them but all makes of keyboards do respond for ASCII based fonts very well. I mean let us be a little more practical in solving this problem of having relieble devnagri fonts on windows. Hope this explains my stand on the issue. "Vikrant" wrote: The problem, Ashok, with developing Hindi (Devanagri) fonts is not that they don't exist but that the characters on the English keyboard are not standard. I used to have over 40 different Hindi fonts developed by different people. However, there was always one common problem: none of the keys were standard. For example: the Hindi "k" or "kh" would be found on the "k" key on one key but if I changed the font, it would be found on an entirely different key! This caused many problems and every time I would have to relearn the keys. One can imagine the heartache caused if every time you changed fonts using the roman script, you would have to relearn the keyboard. I think our first step before adopting the font should be a comprehensive analysis of all Hindi characters and incorporating these onto the standard keyboard. This also includes having unique ASCII codes. I know that there are Hindi typewriters (not keyboards!) but I have not been able to get my hands on any of these. This would be the first place to start because the keys are "standard". Developing a haphazard system of assigning hindi characters to any key has many risks for the reasons above. In addition, we need to identify ALL possible characters (i.e. "ka", half "ka", visarg, ardha visarg, placing "ka" beneath some letters as in a subscript (which is common in some words), etc.. The Devanaagri (more comprehensive than Hindi) typewriter, I believe managed to capture all of these nuances and not just common symbols. I, however, commend you on your effort. Perhaps, first, we need to begin by users who know of or have a hindi typewriter to: 1. Take a picture of this keyboard (which hopefully identifies the keys) and gives a layout of how this keyboard was developed 2. Email all possible combinations of these hindi/sanskrit characters to Mr. Kothare so that we can truly develop a comprehensive and unified system of coding keys that will remaiin constant, regardless of which font a user chooses. Thanks, Vikrant. -- Vikrant "Ashok Kothare" wrote: I have developed Indian Language fonts to be used on english key board. I have been giving them to all those who want to use them on windows to write in Indian languages such as Hindi, Marathi, Konkani, Sindhi, Bhojpuri and more free of cost. My suggestion to microsoft is that they should accept these fonts as default fonts on their windows version of today and tomorrow. This will definitely improve use of windows in Indian Homes. Mcrosoft is already havig some versions of fonts to write in these languages but they need a special driver to be installed additionally. With my fonts which are based on default keyboard driver can work like english fonts on all microsoft programmes and also on other window based programmes. I am doing it to promote use of computers in Indian homes since, english is still not the language of Indian homes. My idea is, if microsoft accepts this suggestion many more users shall benefit by this facility. Presently, I can reach only a fraction of user through my resource. I want all concerned to vote for my suggestion for the benefit of all. I shall give my fonts to those interested in trying them if they ask for them on my email IDs , , Hope to get your full support for this worthy cause. Thanks, Ashok Kothare. ---------------- This post is a suggestion for Microsoft, and Microsoft responds to the suggestions with the most votes. To vote for this suggestion, click the "I Agree" button in the message pane. If you do not see the button, follow this link to open the suggestion in the Microsoft Web-based Newsreader and then click "I Agree" in the message pane. http://www.microsoft.com/office/comm...ocmanagemen t |
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#15
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Indian language fonts to be included as default fonts in windo
I honestly don't know the answer to that question. You might try this link:
http://office.microsoft.com/en-us/su...ename=5&Type=2 It has a "Products" suggestions. I'm not sure what happens to those either but I do know they at least go to Microsoft. Best of luck in your venture!! :-) ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Beth Melton Microsoft Office MVP https://mvp.support.microsoft.com/profile/Melton What is a Microsoft MVP? http://mvp.support.microsoft.com/gp/mvpfaqs "Ashok Kothare" wrote in message ... I appreciate your advice Beth Melton. If this is not the way to offer my fonts to MS then what is the right method of approach to MS? Can you suggest. Thanks for the advice. "Beth Melton" wrote: I'm not sure how you made your offer to Microsoft but if the only method you used is the 'Suggestion to Microsoft' post type in the newsgroup then unfortunately it will likely fall on deaf ears. Microsoft doesn't monitor these newsgroups or the Suggestion posts. For example, if you filter this group for "Suggestions with Microsoft Response" you'll see exactly 1 Microsoft response to a suggestion. That was about 3 years ago. You may also want to note the response was around 10 months after the initial suggestion. Oh, and did I mention the post was actually a test for suggestions to see if MS would actually respond? Interestingly, the response was posted not long after several of us drew attention to the fact MS wasn't responding to Suggestion posts in the newsgroup. g ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Beth Melton "Ashok Kothare" wrote in message ... My offer to Microsoft is actually to remedy this problem. Supposing Microsoft accept my offer and actually include my fonts with my keyboard set up then users will not bother to go for other fonts and rest with my fonts. |
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#16
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Indian language fonts to be included as default fonts in windo
On Feb 25, 8:49*am, Ashok Kothare
wrote: Grammatim suggests to use insert font from word. NO. That was to prove to you that you can use Unicode-encoded characters in an ordinary (English-language) document. (Insert SYMBOL. not "insert font," whatever that would be.) This works so long as you are working in word. If you want to work in photo paint, page maker, photoshop and such different programmes these fonts do not work. NO. They work in ANY program running in Windows (that was written after Unicode was implemented in Windows). With my fonts user can work freely in all the programmes workable on windows and so they have an advantage above those fonts. I thing it is immaterial whether a font is ascii based or unicode based so long as it works on the machine properly. That is exactly the attitude that led to the chaos that made Unicode a necessity by 1990. Were you using a personal computer in 1985? I was. Insistance for unicode fonts have in some cases caused problems with keyboards. Not all keyboards respond well for them but all makes of keyboards do respond for ASCII based fonts very well. Maybe in India you have "makes of keyboards" that do not follow international standards. The "make of keyboard" cannot have anything to do with the signal sent to your computer by depressing each key! |
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#17
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Indian language fonts to be included as default fonts in windo
Thanks for your suggestion Beth. I find that on that site only suggestions
for improving the microsoft online web site are received and no suggestion for improving microsoft OS are considered. The list of topics does not include this topic! It looks as if MS do not expect a suggestion from unknown people like me to improve working of their OSs in Indian market. Ashok Kothare "Beth Melton" wrote: I honestly don't know the answer to that question. You might try this link: http://office.microsoft.com/en-us/su...ename=5&Type=2 It has a "Products" suggestions. I'm not sure what happens to those either but I do know they at least go to Microsoft. Best of luck in your venture!! :-) ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Beth Melton Microsoft Office MVP https://mvp.support.microsoft.com/profile/Melton What is a Microsoft MVP? http://mvp.support.microsoft.com/gp/mvpfaqs "Ashok Kothare" wrote in message ... I appreciate your advice Beth Melton. If this is not the way to offer my fonts to MS then what is the right method of approach to MS? Can you suggest. Thanks for the advice. "Beth Melton" wrote: I'm not sure how you made your offer to Microsoft but if the only method you used is the 'Suggestion to Microsoft' post type in the newsgroup then unfortunately it will likely fall on deaf ears. Microsoft doesn't monitor these newsgroups or the Suggestion posts. For example, if you filter this group for "Suggestions with Microsoft Response" you'll see exactly 1 Microsoft response to a suggestion. That was about 3 years ago. You may also want to note the response was around 10 months after the initial suggestion. Oh, and did I mention the post was actually a test for suggestions to see if MS would actually respond? Interestingly, the response was posted not long after several of us drew attention to the fact MS wasn't responding to Suggestion posts in the newsgroup. g ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Beth Melton "Ashok Kothare" wrote in message ... My offer to Microsoft is actually to remedy this problem. Supposing Microsoft accept my offer and actually include my fonts with my keyboard set up then users will not bother to go for other fonts and rest with my fonts. |
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#18
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Indian language fonts to be included as default fonts in windo
I'm sorry, Askok, that's the only place I know to submit suggestions.
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Beth Melton Microsoft Office MVP https://mvp.support.microsoft.com/profile/Melton What is a Microsoft MVP? http://mvp.support.microsoft.com/gp/mvpfaqs "Ashok Kothare" wrote in message ... Thanks for your suggestion Beth. I find that on that site only suggestions for improving the microsoft online web site are received and no suggestion for improving microsoft OS are considered. The list of topics does not include this topic! It looks as if MS do not expect a suggestion from unknown people like me to improve working of their OSs in Indian market. Ashok Kothare "Beth Melton" wrote: I honestly don't know the answer to that question. You might try this link: http://office.microsoft.com/en-us/su...ename=5&Type=2 It has a "Products" suggestions. I'm not sure what happens to those either but I do know they at least go to Microsoft. Best of luck in your venture!! :-) "Ashok Kothare" wrote in message ... I appreciate your advice Beth Melton. If this is not the way to offer my fonts to MS then what is the right method of approach to MS? Can you suggest. Thanks for the advice. "Beth Melton" wrote: I'm not sure how you made your offer to Microsoft but if the only method you used is the 'Suggestion to Microsoft' post type in the newsgroup then unfortunately it will likely fall on deaf ears. Microsoft doesn't monitor these newsgroups or the Suggestion posts. For example, if you filter this group for "Suggestions with Microsoft Response" you'll see exactly 1 Microsoft response to a suggestion. That was about 3 years ago. You may also want to note the response was around 10 months after the initial suggestion. Oh, and did I mention the post was actually a test for suggestions to see if MS would actually respond? Interestingly, the response was posted not long after several of us drew attention to the fact MS wasn't responding to Suggestion posts in the newsgroup. g ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Beth Melton "Ashok Kothare" wrote in message ... My offer to Microsoft is actually to remedy this problem. Supposing Microsoft accept my offer and actually include my fonts with my keyboard set up then users will not bother to go for other fonts and rest with my fonts. |
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#19
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Indian language fonts to be included as default fonts in windows
Friends, I am resuming the dialogue after about seven months. Somebody told
me that transliteration is the answer to the problem of Indian language inclusion as default font. I have studied the suggestion and come with reply. that reply is in details and so I have put it on my blog. Please visit my blog to read it. It is a research paper too lengthy for this box. URL of my blog http://kothareashok.blog.co.in and you may reply to it on this site as well as on the comment box. "Ashok Kothare" wrote: I have developed Indian Language fonts to be used on english key board. I have been giving them to all those who want to use them on windows to write in Indian languages such as Hindi, Marathi, Konkani, Sindhi, Bhojpuri and more free of cost. My suggestion to microsoft is that they should accept these fonts as default fonts on their windows version of today and tomorrow. This will definitely improve use of windows in Indian Homes. Mcrosoft is already havig some versions of fonts to write in these languages but they need a special driver to be installed additionally. With my fonts which are based on default keyboard driver can work like english fonts on all microsoft programmes and also on other window based programmes. I am doing it to promote use of computers in Indian homes since, english is still not the language of Indian homes. My idea is, if microsoft accepts this suggestion many more users shall benefit by this facility. Presently, I can reach only a fraction of user through my resource. I want all concerned to vote for my suggestion for the benefit of all. I shall give my fonts to those interested in trying them if they ask for them on my email IDs , , Hope to get your full support for this worthy cause. Thanks, Ashok Kothare. ---------------- This post is a suggestion for Microsoft, and Microsoft responds to the suggestions with the most votes. To vote for this suggestion, click the "I Agree" button in the message pane. If you do not see the button, follow this link to open the suggestion in the Microsoft Web-based Newsreader and then click "I Agree" in the message pane. http://www.microsoft.com/office/comm...ocmanagemen t |
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#20
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Indian language fonts to be included as default fonts in windows
Sorry, but I don't see what "Govinda as a sport" or "soya sauce" or
anything in between have to do with Indian typography. On Sep 5, 6:17*am, Ashok Kothare Ashok wrote: Friends, I am resuming the dialogue after about seven months. Somebody told me that transliteration is the answer to the problem of Indian language inclusion as default font. I have studied the suggestion and come with reply. that reply is in details and so I have put it on my blog. Please visit my blog to read it. It is a research paper too lengthy for this box. URL of my blog *http://kothareashok.blog.co.in and you may reply to it on this site as well as on the comment box. "Ashok Kothare" wrote: I have developed Indian Language fonts to be used on english key board. I have been giving them to all those who want to use them on windows to write in Indian languages such as Hindi, Marathi, Konkani, Sindhi, Bhojpuri and more free of cost. My suggestion to microsoft is that they should accept these fonts as default fonts on their windows version of today and tomorrow. This will definitely improve use of windows in Indian Homes. Mcrosoft is already havig some versions of fonts to write in these languages but they need a special driver to be installed additionally. With my fonts which are based on default keyboard driver can work like english fonts on all microsoft programmes and also on other window based programmes. I am doing it to promote use of computers in Indian homes since, english is still not the language of Indian homes. My idea is, if microsoft accepts this suggestion many more users shall benefit by this facility. Presently, I can reach only a fraction of user through my resource. I want all concerned to vote for my suggestion for the benefit of all. I shall give my fonts to those interested in trying them if they ask for them on my email IDs , , Hope to get your full support for this worthy cause. Thanks, Ashok Kothare. ---------------- This post is a suggestion for Microsoft, and Microsoft responds to the suggestions with the most votes. To vote for this suggestion, click the "I Agree" button in the message pane. If you do not see the button, follow this link to open the suggestion in the Microsoft Web-based Newsreader and then click "I Agree" in the message pane. http://www.microsoft.com/office/comm...?mid=d329....- Hide quoted text - - Show quoted text - |
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#21
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Indian language fonts to be included as default fonts in windows
Hi Ashok,
Can you provide the link to the specific document you're referring to in your post? The Transliteration article on your blog at http://kothareashok.blog.co.in/transliteration/ basically says 'coming soon'.  ============== "Ashok Kothare" Ashok wrote in message ... Friends, I am resuming the dialogue after about seven months. Somebody told me that transliteration is the answer to the problem of Indian language inclusion as default font. I have studied the suggestion and come with reply. that reply is in details and so I have put it on my blog. Please visit my blog to read it. It is a research paper too lengthy for this box. URL of my blog http://kothareashok.blog.co.in and you may reply to it on this site as well as on the comment box. -- Bob Buckland ?:-) MS Office System Products MVP *Courtesy is not expensive and can pay big dividends* |
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#22
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Indian language fonts to be included as default fonts in windo
I am very sorry that the page on my blog was written next day due to internet
problem at my end. Now you can read my article on the page Transliteration and please write back for your comments here and also if possible on the comment box of the blog. That page shall remain on the blog for some time now, for all interested observers. Friend Grammtin, please note. "Bob Buckland ?:-)" wrote: Hi Ashok, Can you provide the link to the specific document you're referring to in your post? The Transliteration article on your blog at http://kothareashok.blog.co.in/transliteration/ basically says 'coming soon'. ============== "Ashok Kothare" Ashok wrote in message ... Friends, I am resuming the dialogue after about seven months. Somebody told me that transliteration is the answer to the problem of Indian language inclusion as default font. I have studied the suggestion and come with reply. that reply is in details and so I have put it on my blog. Please visit my blog to read it. It is a research paper too lengthy for this box. URL of my blog http://kothareashok.blog.co.in and you may reply to it on this site as well as on the comment box. -- Bob Buckland ?:-) MS Office System Products MVP *Courtesy is not expensive and can pay big dividends* |
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#23
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Indian language fonts to be included as default fonts in windo
Well, to get the link, I had to go to Bob Buckland's message.
The "essay" contains a great deal of blather. I gather "orkut" is an Indian ISP? You seem to have two points. (1) Transliteration is not necessary. (2) Windows cannot properly handle Indian scripts. (1) is a matter of opinion and is correct in some circumstances, incorrect in others. (2), as I and others told you more than half a year ago, is simply incorrect. Every version of Windows since I-don't-know-when has provided full support for typing in the 11 standard scripts of India (roman, Nagari, Gujarati, Gurmukhi, Bengali, Oriya, Kannada, Telugu, Tamil, Malayalam, Urdu), with a dedicated keyboard for each. All of them have been included in Unicode since Version 1.0 nearly 20 years ago. On Sep 14, 5:09*am, Ashok Kothare wrote: I am very sorry that the page on my blog was written next day due to internet problem at my end. Now you can read my article on the page Transliteration and please write back for your comments here and also if possible on the comment box of the blog. That page shall remain on the blog for some time now, for all interested observers. Friend Grammtin, please note. "Bob * Buckland ?:-)" wrote: Hi Ashok, Can you provide the link to the specific document you're referring to in your post? *The Transliteration article on your blog at *http://kothareashok.blog.co.in/transliteration/ basically says 'coming soon'. ============== * "Ashok Kothare" Ashok wrote in message ... Friends, I am resuming the dialogue after about seven months. Somebody told me that transliteration is the answer to the problem of Indian language inclusion as default font. I have studied the suggestion and come with reply. that reply is in details and so I have put it on my blog. Please visit my blog to read it. It is a research paper too lengthy for this box. URL of my blog http://kothareashok.blog.co.in and you may reply to it on this site as well as on the comment box. * |
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#24
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Indian language fonts to be included as default fonts in windo
Dear Grammatim, you are very sure that everything has been done to make
windows suitable to write in Indian languages. I am afraid you are not correct. Another point you have put is that unicode has been finalized for Indian languages is also not correct. If you see unicodes used by fonts such as 'mangal' you will see that they are not placed on the unicodes recommended for Indian languages but they are put on other nondescript unicode places. If windows do that how that can be justified? I want Microsoft to be a perfect instrument to get proper unicodes to be used for these languages. I will add one more page to my blog soon to show you the difference in what unicodes are used by microsoft Indian fonts and what are the actuall unicodes offered by the unicode. I want to know why microsoft is doing this? Is it justified to put fonts of a langauge on wrong unicodes? My intentions are that let us do something that is, in given times, helpful to users in India. Please do not misunderstand me. I want to know what Bob has to say. Please visit my blog after 8 days to avoid any misunderstanding. I have internet server problem here and that makes it difficult to do posting in time sorry for that. Remember, we Indians wish to use english version of windows and want to write our messages in Indian languages since that is most convenient at this time. We often toggle between both languages and for that english version is most suitable. with regards. "grammatim" wrote: Well, to get the link, I had to go to Bob Buckland's message. The "essay" contains a great deal of blather. I gather "orkut" is an Indian ISP? You seem to have two points. (1) Transliteration is not necessary. (2) Windows cannot properly handle Indian scripts. (1) is a matter of opinion and is correct in some circumstances, incorrect in others. (2), as I and others told you more than half a year ago, is simply incorrect. Every version of Windows since I-don't-know-when has provided full support for typing in the 11 standard scripts of India (roman, Nagari, Gujarati, Gurmukhi, Bengali, Oriya, Kannada, Telugu, Tamil, Malayalam, Urdu), with a dedicated keyboard for each. All of them have been included in Unicode since Version 1.0 nearly 20 years ago. On Sep 14, 5:09 am, Ashok Kothare wrote: I am very sorry that the page on my blog was written next day due to internet problem at my end. Now you can read my article on the page Transliteration and please write back for your comments here and also if possible on the comment box of the blog. That page shall remain on the blog for some time now, for all interested observers. Friend Grammtin, please note. "Bob Buckland ?:-)" wrote: Hi Ashok, Can you provide the link to the specific document you're referring to in your post? The Transliteration article on your blog at http://kothareashok.blog.co.in/transliteration/ basically says 'coming soon'. ============== "Ashok Kothare" Ashok wrote in message ... Friends, I am resuming the dialogue after about seven months. Somebody told me that transliteration is the answer to the problem of Indian language inclusion as default font. I have studied the suggestion and come with reply. that reply is in details and so I have put it on my blog. Please visit my blog to read it. It is a research paper too lengthy for this box. URL of my blog http://kothareashok.blog.co.in and you may reply to it on this site as well as on the comment box. |
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#25
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Indian language fonts to be included as default fonts in windo
On Sep 16, 8:03*am, Ashok Kothare
wrote: Dear Grammatim, you are very sure that everything has been done to make windows suitable to write in Indian languages. "Everything"? I have no idea what "everything" might be. You can type in the 11 standard Indian scripts without adding anything at all to Windows out-of-the-box. Conjuncts are formed, and matras are placed, automatically as you type the sounds of the letters in the order they are spoken -- you don't even need to type i before the consonant, or o both before and after (Bengali). Once you have selected the (or a) keyboard for your language, you begin to get characters in that script, in whatever the system's default might be. For some it's Arial Unicode, for some it's Sylfaen, for some (Urdu, Sindhi), it's Times New Roman. I am afraid you are not correct. Another point you have put is that unicode has been finalized for Indian languages is also not correct. If you see unicodes used by fonts such as 'mangal' *you will see that they are not placed on the unicodes recommended for Indian languages but they are put on other nondescript unicode places. It is hardly Unicode's fault that some font designers have failed to adhere to Unicode standards. I have not heard of "mangal"; for what script is it a font? If windows do that how that can be justified? I want "Windows" do not "do that." Font designers do that. Maybe "mangal" is 20 years old and was made before computers could handle more than 128 or 256 characters. Microsoft to be a perfect instrument to get proper unicodes to be used for these languages. I will add one more page to my blog soon to show you the difference in what unicodes are used by microsoft Indian fonts and what are the actuall unicodes offered by the unicode. I want to know why microsoft is doing this? Is it justified to put fonts of a langauge on wrong unicodes? My Certainly not. intentions are that let us do something that is, in given times, helpful to users in India. Please do not misunderstand me. I want to know what Bob has to say. Please visit my blog after 8 days to avoid any misunderstanding. I Post the link here next week. have internet server problem here and that makes it difficult to do posting in time sorry for that. Remember, we Indians wish to use english version of windows and want to write our messages in Indian languages since that is most convenient at this time. We often toggle between both languages and for that english version is most suitable. with regards. I of course use English version of Windows, and I have no trouble typing in any of the Indian languages. I can toggle between English and any of the languages either by choosing them from the Language Bar, or by pressing LeftAlt+Shift, or by assigning a specific shortcut to each keyboard (though because I use many, many different scripts in my work, I have different selections of keyboards installed at different times, so I don't bother with specific shortcuts except for getting back to English.) "grammatim" wrote: Well, to get the link, I had to go to Bob Buckland's message. The "essay" contains a great deal of blather. I gather "orkut" is an Indian ISP? You seem to have two points. (1) Transliteration is not necessary. (2) Windows cannot properly handle Indian scripts. (1) is a matter of opinion and is correct in some circumstances, incorrect in others. (2), as I and others told you more than half a year ago, is simply incorrect. Every version of Windows since I-don't-know-when has provided full support for typing in the 11 standard scripts of India (roman, Nagari, Gujarati, Gurmukhi, Bengali, Oriya, Kannada, Telugu, Tamil, Malayalam, Urdu), with a dedicated keyboard for each. All of them have been included in Unicode since Version 1.0 nearly 20 years ago. On Sep 14, 5:09 am, Ashok Kothare wrote: I am very sorry that the page on my blog was written next day due to internet problem at my end. Now you can read my article on the page Transliteration and please write back for your comments here and also if possible on the comment box of the blog. That page shall remain on the blog for some time now, for all interested observers. Friend Grammtin, please note. "Bob * Buckland ?:-)" wrote: Hi Ashok, Can you provide the link to the specific document you're referring to in your post? *The Transliteration article on your blog at *http://kothareashok.blog.co.in/transliteration/ basically says 'coming soon'. ============== * "Ashok Kothare" Ashok wrote in message ... Friends, I am resuming the dialogue after about seven months. Somebody told me that transliteration is the answer to the problem of Indian language inclusion as default font. I have studied the suggestion and come with reply. that reply is in details and so I have put it on my blog. Please visit my blog to read it. It is a research paper too lengthy for this box. URL of my blog http://kothareashok.blog.co.in and you may reply to it on this site as well as on the comment box. *- |
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#26
Posted to microsoft.public.word.docmanagement
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Indian language fonts to be included as default fonts in windo
As I had said in my last mail I have loaded a page on my blog. the page is
"Grammatim". Please log on the blog and read the page. Also ask other interested in the topic to read it. My blog, http://kothareashok.blog.co.in Ashok Kothare "grammatim" wrote: On Sep 16, 8:03 am, Ashok Kothare wrote: Dear Grammatim, you are very sure that everything has been done to make windows suitable to write in Indian languages. "Everything"? I have no idea what "everything" might be. You can type in the 11 standard Indian scripts without adding anything at all to Windows out-of-the-box. Conjuncts are formed, and matras are placed, automatically as you type the sounds of the letters in the order they are spoken -- you don't even need to type i before the consonant, or o both before and after (Bengali). Once you have selected the (or a) keyboard for your language, you begin to get characters in that script, in whatever the system's default might be. For some it's Arial Unicode, for some it's Sylfaen, for some (Urdu, Sindhi), it's Times New Roman. I am afraid you are not correct. Another point you have put is that unicode has been finalized for Indian languages is also not correct. If you see unicodes used by fonts such as 'mangal' you will see that they are not placed on the unicodes recommended for Indian languages but they are put on other nondescript unicode places. It is hardly Unicode's fault that some font designers have failed to adhere to Unicode standards. I have not heard of "mangal"; for what script is it a font? If windows do that how that can be justified? I want "Windows" do not "do that." Font designers do that. Maybe "mangal" is 20 years old and was made before computers could handle more than 128 or 256 characters. Microsoft to be a perfect instrument to get proper unicodes to be used for these languages. I will add one more page to my blog soon to show you the difference in what unicodes are used by microsoft Indian fonts and what are the actuall unicodes offered by the unicode. I want to know why microsoft is doing this? Is it justified to put fonts of a langauge on wrong unicodes? My Certainly not. intentions are that let us do something that is, in given times, helpful to users in India. Please do not misunderstand me. I want to know what Bob has to say. Please visit my blog after 8 days to avoid any misunderstanding. I Post the link here next week. have internet server problem here and that makes it difficult to do posting in time sorry for that. Remember, we Indians wish to use english version of windows and want to write our messages in Indian languages since that is most convenient at this time. We often toggle between both languages and for that english version is most suitable. with regards. I of course use English version of Windows, and I have no trouble typing in any of the Indian languages. I can toggle between English and any of the languages either by choosing them from the Language Bar, or by pressing LeftAlt+Shift, or by assigning a specific shortcut to each keyboard (though because I use many, many different scripts in my work, I have different selections of keyboards installed at different times, so I don't bother with specific shortcuts except for getting back to English.) "grammatim" wrote: Well, to get the link, I had to go to Bob Buckland's message. The "essay" contains a great deal of blather. I gather "orkut" is an Indian ISP? You seem to have two points. (1) Transliteration is not necessary. (2) Windows cannot properly handle Indian scripts. (1) is a matter of opinion and is correct in some circumstances, incorrect in others. (2), as I and others told you more than half a year ago, is simply incorrect. Every version of Windows since I-don't-know-when has provided full support for typing in the 11 standard scripts of India (roman, Nagari, Gujarati, Gurmukhi, Bengali, Oriya, Kannada, Telugu, Tamil, Malayalam, Urdu), with a dedicated keyboard for each. All of them have been included in Unicode since Version 1.0 nearly 20 years ago. On Sep 14, 5:09 am, Ashok Kothare wrote: I am very sorry that the page on my blog was written next day due to internet problem at my end. Now you can read my article on the page Transliteration and please write back for your comments here and also if possible on the comment box of the blog. That page shall remain on the blog for some time now, for all interested observers. Friend Grammtin, please note. "Bob Buckland ?:-)" wrote: Hi Ashok, Can you provide the link to the specific document you're referring to in your post? The Transliteration article on your blog at http://kothareashok.blog.co.in/transliteration/ basically says 'coming soon'. ============== "Ashok Kothare" Ashok wrote in message ... Friends, I am resuming the dialogue after about seven months. Somebody told me that transliteration is the answer to the problem of Indian language inclusion as default font. I have studied the suggestion and come with reply. that reply is in details and so I have put it on my blog. Please visit my blog to read it. It is a research paper too lengthy for this box. URL of my blog http://kothareashok.blog.co.in and you may reply to it on this site as well as on the comment box. - |
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#27
Posted to microsoft.public.word.docmanagement
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Indian language fonts to be included as default fonts in windo
It has not been "eight days" since your last posting.
I have read your blog page called "Grammatim" and I have no idea what you are talking about. Mangal font is on my computer -- installed with Vista last month; until I get my old hard drive back, I cannot know whether some recent earlier version of Mangal did not comply with Unicode -- I opened it with BabelMap and found that it contains every Unicode-specified character in its proper place. (The glyph variants involved in constructing conjuncts and adding matras are handled behind the scenes, by the Devanagari IME.) It is possible that you have a very, very, very old version of Mangal, if you do not have the 110 Mangal characters in their proper places. On Sep 18, 7:45*am, Ashok Kothare wrote: As I had said in my last mail I have loaded a page on my blog. the page is "Grammatim". Please log on the blog and read the page. Also ask other interested in the topic to read it. My blog,http://kothareashok.blog.co.in Ashok Kothare "grammatim" wrote: On Sep 16, 8:03 am, Ashok Kothare wrote: Dear Grammatim, you are very sure that everything has been done to make windows suitable to write in Indian languages. "Everything"? I have no idea what "everything" might be. You can type in the 11 standard Indian scripts without adding anything at all to Windows out-of-the-box. Conjuncts are formed, and matras are placed, automatically as you type the sounds of the letters in the order they are spoken -- you don't even need to type i before the consonant, or o both before and after (Bengali). Once you have selected the (or a) keyboard for your language, you begin to get characters in that script, in whatever the system's default might be. For some it's Arial Unicode, for some it's Sylfaen, for some (Urdu, Sindhi), it's Times New Roman. I am afraid you are not correct. Another point you have put is that unicode has been finalized for Indian languages is also not correct. If you see unicodes used by fonts such as 'mangal' *you will see that they are not placed on the unicodes recommended for Indian languages but they are put on other nondescript unicode places. It is hardly Unicode's fault that some font designers have failed to adhere to Unicode standards. I have not heard of "mangal"; for what script is it a font? If windows do that how that can be justified? I want "Windows" do not "do that." Font designers do that. Maybe "mangal" is 20 years old and was made before computers could handle more than 128 or 256 characters. Microsoft to be a perfect instrument to get proper unicodes to be used for these languages. I will add one more page to my blog soon to show you the difference in what unicodes are used by microsoft Indian fonts and what are the actuall unicodes offered by the unicode. I want to know why microsoft is doing this? Is it justified to put fonts of a langauge on wrong unicodes? My Certainly not. intentions are that let us do something that is, in given times, helpful to users in India. Please do not misunderstand me. I want to know what Bob has to say. Please visit my blog after 8 days to avoid any misunderstanding. I Post the link here next week. have internet server problem here and that makes it difficult to do posting in time sorry for that. Remember, we Indians wish to use english version of windows and want to write our messages in Indian languages since that is most convenient at this time. We often toggle between both languages and for that english version is most suitable. with regards. I of course use English version of Windows, and I have no trouble typing in any of the Indian languages. I can toggle between English and any of the languages either by choosing them from the Language Bar, or by pressing LeftAlt+Shift, or by assigning a specific shortcut to each keyboard (though because I use many, many different scripts in my work, I have different selections of keyboards installed at different times, so I don't bother with specific shortcuts except for getting back to English.) "grammatim" wrote: Well, to get the link, I had to go to Bob Buckland's message. The "essay" contains a great deal of blather. I gather "orkut" is an Indian ISP? You seem to have two points. (1) Transliteration is not necessary. (2) Windows cannot properly handle Indian scripts. (1) is a matter of opinion and is correct in some circumstances, incorrect in others. (2), as I and others told you more than half a year ago, is simply incorrect. Every version of Windows since I-don't-know-when has provided full support for typing in the 11 standard scripts of India (roman, Nagari, Gujarati, Gurmukhi, Bengali, Oriya, Kannada, Telugu, Tamil, Malayalam, Urdu), with a dedicated keyboard for each. All of them have been included in Unicode since Version 1.0 nearly 20 years ago. On Sep 14, 5:09 am, Ashok Kothare wrote: I am very sorry that the page on my blog was written next day due to internet problem at my end. Now you can read my article on the page Transliteration and please write back for your comments here and also if possible on the comment box of the blog. That page shall remain on the blog for some time now, for all interested observers. Friend Grammtin, please note. "Bob * Buckland ?:-)" wrote: Hi Ashok, Can you provide the link to the specific document you're referring to in your post? *The Transliteration article on your blog at *http://kothareashok.blog.co.in/transliteration/ basically says 'coming soon'. ============== * "Ashok Kothare" Ashok wrote in message ... Friends, I am resuming the dialogue after about seven months. Somebody told me that transliteration is the answer to the problem of Indian language inclusion as default font. I have studied the suggestion and come with reply. that reply is in details and so I have put it on my blog. Please visit my blog to read it. It is a research paper too lengthy for this box. URL of my blog http://kothareashok.blog.co.in and you may reply to it on this site as well as on the comment box. * |
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#28
Posted to microsoft.public.word.docmanagement
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Indian language fonts to be included as default fonts in windo
Thanks for the reply. I want others in the discussion group to say what they
want to say. Your argument does not justify violation of the unicode by Microsoft. Whether latest or very old the violation has been done. That is the point. I wish some person from the Microsoft connected with this font work come up and reply. May be you can arrange for it. May be, dear Grammatim, you are not competent to answer my query. "grammatim" wrote: It has not been "eight days" since your last posting. I have read your blog page called "Grammatim" and I have no idea what you are talking about. Mangal font is on my computer -- installed with Vista last month; until I get my old hard drive back, I cannot know whether some recent earlier version of Mangal did not comply with Unicode -- I opened it with BabelMap and found that it contains every Unicode-specified character in its proper place. (The glyph variants involved in constructing conjuncts and adding matras are handled behind the scenes, by the Devanagari IME.) It is possible that you have a very, very, very old version of Mangal, if you do not have the 110 Mangal characters in their proper places. On Sep 18, 7:45 am, Ashok Kothare wrote: As I had said in my last mail I have loaded a page on my blog. the page is "Grammatim". Please log on the blog and read the page. Also ask other interested in the topic to read it. My blog,http://kothareashok.blog.co.in Ashok Kothare "grammatim" wrote: On Sep 16, 8:03 am, Ashok Kothare wrote: Dear Grammatim, you are very sure that everything has been done to make windows suitable to write in Indian languages. "Everything"? I have no idea what "everything" might be. You can type in the 11 standard Indian scripts without adding anything at all to Windows out-of-the-box. Conjuncts are formed, and matras are placed, automatically as you type the sounds of the letters in the order they are spoken -- you don't even need to type i before the consonant, or o both before and after (Bengali). Once you have selected the (or a) keyboard for your language, you begin to get characters in that script, in whatever the system's default might be. For some it's Arial Unicode, for some it's Sylfaen, for some (Urdu, Sindhi), it's Times New Roman. I am afraid you are not correct. Another point you have put is that unicode has been finalized for Indian languages is also not correct. If you see unicodes used by fonts such as 'mangal' you will see that they are not placed on the unicodes recommended for Indian languages but they are put on other nondescript unicode places. It is hardly Unicode's fault that some font designers have failed to adhere to Unicode standards. I have not heard of "mangal"; for what script is it a font? If windows do that how that can be justified? I want "Windows" do not "do that." Font designers do that. Maybe "mangal" is 20 years old and was made before computers could handle more than 128 or 256 characters. Microsoft to be a perfect instrument to get proper unicodes to be used for these languages. I will add one more page to my blog soon to show you the difference in what unicodes are used by microsoft Indian fonts and what are the actuall unicodes offered by the unicode. I want to know why microsoft is doing this? Is it justified to put fonts of a langauge on wrong unicodes? My Certainly not. intentions are that let us do something that is, in given times, helpful to users in India. Please do not misunderstand me. I want to know what Bob has to say. Please visit my blog after 8 days to avoid any misunderstanding. I Post the link here next week. have internet server problem here and that makes it difficult to do posting in time sorry for that. Remember, we Indians wish to use english version of windows and want to write our messages in Indian languages since that is most convenient at this time. We often toggle between both languages and for that english version is most suitable. with regards. I of course use English version of Windows, and I have no trouble typing in any of the Indian languages. I can toggle between English and any of the languages either by choosing them from the Language Bar, or by pressing LeftAlt+Shift, or by assigning a specific shortcut to each keyboard (though because I use many, many different scripts in my work, I have different selections of keyboards installed at different times, so I don't bother with specific shortcuts except for getting back to English.) "grammatim" wrote: Well, to get the link, I had to go to Bob Buckland's message. The "essay" contains a great deal of blather. I gather "orkut" is an Indian ISP? You seem to have two points. (1) Transliteration is not necessary. (2) Windows cannot properly handle Indian scripts. (1) is a matter of opinion and is correct in some circumstances, incorrect in others. (2), as I and others told you more than half a year ago, is simply incorrect. Every version of Windows since I-don't-know-when has provided full support for typing in the 11 standard scripts of India (roman, Nagari, Gujarati, Gurmukhi, Bengali, Oriya, Kannada, Telugu, Tamil, Malayalam, Urdu), with a dedicated keyboard for each. All of them have been included in Unicode since Version 1.0 nearly 20 years ago. On Sep 14, 5:09 am, Ashok Kothare wrote: I am very sorry that the page on my blog was written next day due to internet problem at my end. Now you can read my article on the page Transliteration and please write back for your comments here and also if possible on the comment box of the blog. That page shall remain on the blog for some time now, for all interested observers. Friend Grammtin, please note. "Bob Buckland ?:-)" wrote: Hi Ashok, Can you provide the link to the specific document you're referring to in your post? The Transliteration article on your blog at http://kothareashok.blog.co.in/transliteration/ basically says 'coming soon'. ============== "Ashok Kothare" Ashok wrote in message ... Friends, I am resuming the dialogue after about seven months. Somebody told me that transliteration is the answer to the problem of Indian language inclusion as default font. I have studied the suggestion and come with reply. that reply is in details and so I have put it on my blog. Please visit my blog to read it. It is a research paper too lengthy for this box. URL of my blog http://kothareashok.blog.co.in and you may reply to it on this site as well as on the comment box. |
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#29
Posted to microsoft.public.word.docmanagement
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Indian language fonts to be included as default fonts in windo
No one from Microsoft reads this newsgroup.
If the ancient font you insist on continuing to use was made before Unicode was established, you have no right to claim that it does not match Unicode. Just update your computer and download the free fonts. On Sep 23, 3:57*am, Ashok Kothare wrote: Thanks for the reply. I want others in the discussion group to say what they want to say. Your argument does not justify violation of the unicode by Microsoft. Whether latest or very old the violation has been done. That is the point. I wish some person from the Microsoft connected with this font work come up and reply. May be you can arrange for it. May be, dear Grammatim, you are not competent to answer my query. "grammatim" wrote: It has not been "eight days" since your last posting. I have read your blog page called "Grammatim" and I have no idea what you are talking about. Mangal font is on my computer -- installed with Vista last month; until I get my old hard drive back, I cannot know whether some recent earlier version of Mangal did not comply with Unicode -- I opened it with BabelMap and found that it contains every Unicode-specified character in its proper place. (The glyph variants involved in constructing conjuncts and adding matras are handled behind the scenes, by the Devanagari IME.) It is possible that you have a very, very, very old version of Mangal, if you do not have the 110 Mangal characters in their proper places. On Sep 18, 7:45 am, Ashok Kothare wrote: As I had said in my last mail I have loaded a page on my blog. the page is "Grammatim". Please log on the blog and read the page. Also ask other interested in the topic to read it. My blog,http://kothareashok.blog.co.in Ashok Kothare "grammatim" wrote: On Sep 16, 8:03 am, Ashok Kothare wrote: Dear Grammatim, you are very sure that everything has been done to make windows suitable to write in Indian languages. "Everything"? I have no idea what "everything" might be. You can type in the 11 standard Indian scripts without adding anything at all to Windows out-of-the-box. Conjuncts are formed, and matras are placed, automatically as you type the sounds of the letters in the order they are spoken -- you don't even need to type i before the consonant, or o both before and after (Bengali). Once you have selected the (or a) keyboard for your language, you begin to get characters in that script, in whatever the system's default might be. For some it's Arial Unicode, for some it's Sylfaen, for some (Urdu, Sindhi), it's Times New Roman. I am afraid you are not correct. Another point you have put is that unicode has been finalized for Indian languages is also not correct. If you see unicodes used by fonts such as 'mangal' *you will see that they are not placed on the unicodes recommended for Indian languages but they are put on other nondescript unicode places. It is hardly Unicode's fault that some font designers have failed to adhere to Unicode standards. I have not heard of "mangal"; for what script is it a font? If windows do that how that can be justified? I want "Windows" do not "do that." Font designers do that. Maybe "mangal" is 20 years old and was made before computers could handle more than 128 or 256 characters. Microsoft to be a perfect instrument to get proper unicodes to be used for these languages. I will add one more page to my blog soon to show you the difference in what unicodes are used by microsoft Indian fonts and what are the actuall unicodes offered by the unicode. I want to know why microsoft is doing this? Is it justified to put fonts of a langauge on wrong unicodes? My Certainly not. intentions are that let us do something that is, in given times, helpful to users in India. Please do not misunderstand me. I want to know what Bob has to say. Please visit my blog after 8 days to avoid any misunderstanding. I Post the link here next week. have internet server problem here and that makes it difficult to do posting in time sorry for that. Remember, we Indians wish to use english version of windows and want to write our messages in Indian languages since that is most convenient at this time. We often toggle between both languages and for that english version is most suitable. with regards. I of course use English version of Windows, and I have no trouble typing in any of the Indian languages. I can toggle between English and any of the languages either by choosing them from the Language Bar, or by pressing LeftAlt+Shift, or by assigning a specific shortcut to each keyboard (though because I use many, many different scripts in my work, I have different selections of keyboards installed at different times, so I don't bother with specific shortcuts except for getting back to English.) "grammatim" wrote: Well, to get the link, I had to go to Bob Buckland's message. The "essay" contains a great deal of blather. I gather "orkut" is an Indian ISP? You seem to have two points. (1) Transliteration is not necessary. (2) Windows cannot properly handle Indian scripts. (1) is a matter of opinion and is correct in some circumstances, incorrect in others. (2), as I and others told you more than half a year ago, is simply incorrect. Every version of Windows since I-don't-know-when has provided full support for typing in the 11 standard scripts of India (roman, Nagari, Gujarati, Gurmukhi, Bengali, Oriya, Kannada, Telugu, Tamil, Malayalam, Urdu), with a dedicated keyboard for each. All of them have been included in Unicode since Version 1.0 nearly 20 years ago. On Sep 14, 5:09 am, Ashok Kothare wrote: I am very sorry that the page on my blog was written next day due to internet problem at my end. Now you can read my article on the page Transliteration and please write back for your comments here and also if possible on the comment box of the blog. That page shall remain on the blog for some time now, for all interested observers. Friend Grammtin, please note. "Bob * Buckland ?:-)" wrote: Hi Ashok, Can you provide the link to the specific document you're referring to in your post? *The Transliteration article on your blog at *http://kothareashok.blog.co.in/transliteration/ basically says 'coming soon'. ============== * "Ashok Kothare" Ashok wrote in message ... Friends, I am resuming the dialogue after about seven months. Somebody told me that transliteration is the answer to the problem of Indian language inclusion as default font. I have studied the suggestion and come with reply. that reply is in details and so I have put it on my blog. Please visit my blog to read it. It is a research paper too lengthy for this box. URL of my blog http://kothareashok.blog.co.in and you may reply to it on this site as well as on the comment box. *- |
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#30
Posted to microsoft.public.word.docmanagement
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Indian language fonts to be included as default fonts in windo
How do you know that no one from Microsoft reads this newsgroup? If so why
keep it? I have found that Google research reads my comments that means Microsoft definetly knows what is going on in this group. Any way, your advice is perfect but that does not solve the problem. I have put 'My stand' on the page "Grammatim" on my blog. May be it will clear the point. The font I am talking about is copyright 2001. Is it ancient? Unicode were all well set by that time. "grammatim" wrote: No one from Microsoft reads this newsgroup. If the ancient font you insist on continuing to use was made before Unicode was established, you have no right to claim that it does not match Unicode. Just update your computer and download the free fonts. On Sep 23, 3:57 am, Ashok Kothare wrote: Thanks for the reply. I want others in the discussion group to say what they want to say. Your argument does not justify violation of the unicode by Microsoft. Whether latest or very old the violation has been done. That is the point. I wish some person from the Microsoft connected with this font work come up and reply. May be you can arrange for it. May be, dear Grammatim, you are not competent to answer my query. "grammatim" wrote: It has not been "eight days" since your last posting. I have read your blog page called "Grammatim" and I have no idea what you are talking about. Mangal font is on my computer -- installed with Vista last month; until I get my old hard drive back, I cannot know whether some recent earlier version of Mangal did not comply with Unicode -- I opened it with BabelMap and found that it contains every Unicode-specified character in its proper place. (The glyph variants involved in constructing conjuncts and adding matras are handled behind the scenes, by the Devanagari IME.) It is possible that you have a very, very, very old version of Mangal, if you do not have the 110 Mangal characters in their proper places. On Sep 18, 7:45 am, Ashok Kothare wrote: As I had said in my last mail I have loaded a page on my blog. the page is "Grammatim". Please log on the blog and read the page. Also ask other interested in the topic to read it. My blog,http://kothareashok.blog.co.in Ashok Kothare "grammatim" wrote: On Sep 16, 8:03 am, Ashok Kothare wrote: Dear Grammatim, you are very sure that everything has been done to make windows suitable to write in Indian languages. "Everything"? I have no idea what "everything" might be. You can type in the 11 standard Indian scripts without adding anything at all to Windows out-of-the-box. Conjuncts are formed, and matras are placed, automatically as you type the sounds of the letters in the order they are spoken -- you don't even need to type i before the consonant, or o both before and after (Bengali). Once you have selected the (or a) keyboard for your language, you begin to get characters in that script, in whatever the system's default might be. For some it's Arial Unicode, for some it's Sylfaen, for some (Urdu, Sindhi), it's Times New Roman. I am afraid you are not correct. Another point you have put is that unicode has been finalized for Indian languages is also not correct. If you see unicodes used by fonts such as 'mangal' you will see that they are not placed on the unicodes recommended for Indian languages but they are put on other nondescript unicode places. It is hardly Unicode's fault that some font designers have failed to adhere to Unicode standards. I have not heard of "mangal"; for what script is it a font? If windows do that how that can be justified? I want "Windows" do not "do that." Font designers do that. Maybe "mangal" is 20 years old and was made before computers could handle more than 128 or 256 characters. Microsoft to be a perfect instrument to get proper unicodes to be used for these languages. I will add one more page to my blog soon to show you the difference in what unicodes are used by microsoft Indian fonts and what are the actuall unicodes offered by the unicode. I want to know why microsoft is doing this? Is it justified to put fonts of a langauge on wrong unicodes? My Certainly not. intentions are that let us do something that is, in given times, helpful to users in India. Please do not misunderstand me. I want to know what Bob has to say. Please visit my blog after 8 days to avoid any misunderstanding. I Post the link here next week. have internet server problem here and that makes it difficult to do posting in time sorry for that. Remember, we Indians wish to use english version of windows and want to write our messages in Indian languages since that is most convenient at this time. We often toggle between both languages and for that english version is most suitable. with regards. I of course use English version of Windows, and I have no trouble typing in any of the Indian languages. I can toggle between English and any of the languages either by choosing them from the Language Bar, or by pressing LeftAlt+Shift, or by assigning a specific shortcut to each keyboard (though because I use many, many different scripts in my work, I have different selections of keyboards installed at different times, so I don't bother with specific shortcuts except for getting back to English.) "grammatim" wrote: Well, to get the link, I had to go to Bob Buckland's message. The "essay" contains a great deal of blather. I gather "orkut" is an Indian ISP? You seem to have two points. (1) Transliteration is not necessary. (2) Windows cannot properly handle Indian scripts. (1) is a matter of opinion and is correct in some circumstances, incorrect in others. (2), as I and others told you more than half a year ago, is simply incorrect. Every version of Windows since I-don't-know-when has provided full support for typing in the 11 standard scripts of India (roman, Nagari, Gujarati, Gurmukhi, Bengali, Oriya, Kannada, Telugu, Tamil, Malayalam, Urdu), with a dedicated keyboard for each. All of them have been included in Unicode since Version 1.0 nearly 20 years ago. On Sep 14, 5:09 am, Ashok Kothare wrote: I am very sorry that the page on my blog was written next day due to internet problem at my end. Now you can read my article on the page Transliteration and please write back for your comments here and also if possible on the comment box of the blog. That page shall remain on the blog for some time now, for all interested observers. Friend Grammtin, please note. "Bob Buckland ?:-)" wrote: Hi Ashok, Can you provide the link to the specific document you're referring to in your post? The Transliteration article on your blog at http://kothareashok.blog.co.in/transliteration/ basically says 'coming soon'. ============== "Ashok Kothare" Ashok wrote in message ... Friends, I am resuming the dialogue after about seven months. Somebody told me that transliteration is the answer to the problem of Indian language inclusion as default font. I have studied the suggestion and come with reply. that reply is in details and so I have put it on my blog. Please visit my blog to read it. It is a research paper too lengthy for this box. URL of my blog http://kothareashok.blog.co.in and you may reply to it on this site as well as on the comment box. - |
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#31
Posted to microsoft.public.word.docmanagement
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Indian language fonts to be included as default fonts in windo
Firstly, let me confirm that no-one from Microsoft reads this newsgroup.
There may be individual Microsoft employees who read it on their own time (although I doubt it), but it is not officially monitored by Microsoft. I don't know about Google Research but one thing they are not, is connected to Microsoft. Secondly, this seems to be a discussion going nowhere. What grammatim says makes sense, what you, Ashok, say does not make sense to me, although I do accept that that may be due, in part, to my lack of knowledge of Indian scripts. Unicode is a standard supported by all modern software, in so much as special support is needed, but all that unicode really is is a cross reference of code points to named characters. Individual fonts can use whatever glyphs they like to depict the characters at particular code points. Mangal, as installed on my machine, has 110 glyphs at code points in the Devanagari range (0900 to 097F) and I have no reason to think there is anything wrong with them. Are you saying that your version of the font does not have these glyphs? Or that there is something wrong with them? Or are you saying that you have problems entering them from the keyboard? Or what? -- Enjoy, Tony www.WordArticles.com "Ashok Kothare" wrote in message ... How do you know that no one from Microsoft reads this newsgroup? If so why keep it? I have found that Google research reads my comments that means Microsoft definetly knows what is going on in this group. Any way, your advice is perfect but that does not solve the problem. I have put 'My stand' on the page "Grammatim" on my blog. May be it will clear the point. The font I am talking about is copyright 2001. Is it ancient? Unicode were all well set by that time. "grammatim" wrote: No one from Microsoft reads this newsgroup. If the ancient font you insist on continuing to use was made before Unicode was established, you have no right to claim that it does not match Unicode. Just update your computer and download the free fonts. On Sep 23, 3:57 am, Ashok Kothare wrote: Thanks for the reply. I want others in the discussion group to say what they want to say. Your argument does not justify violation of the unicode by Microsoft. Whether latest or very old the violation has been done. That is the point. I wish some person from the Microsoft connected with this font work come up and reply. May be you can arrange for it. May be, dear Grammatim, you are not competent to answer my query. "grammatim" wrote: It has not been "eight days" since your last posting. I have read your blog page called "Grammatim" and I have no idea what you are talking about. Mangal font is on my computer -- installed with Vista last month; until I get my old hard drive back, I cannot know whether some recent earlier version of Mangal did not comply with Unicode -- I opened it with BabelMap and found that it contains every Unicode-specified character in its proper place. (The glyph variants involved in constructing conjuncts and adding matras are handled behind the scenes, by the Devanagari IME.) It is possible that you have a very, very, very old version of Mangal, if you do not have the 110 Mangal characters in their proper places. On Sep 18, 7:45 am, Ashok Kothare wrote: As I had said in my last mail I have loaded a page on my blog. the page is "Grammatim". Please log on the blog and read the page. Also ask other interested in the topic to read it. My blog,http://kothareashok.blog.co.in Ashok Kothare "grammatim" wrote: On Sep 16, 8:03 am, Ashok Kothare wrote: Dear Grammatim, you are very sure that everything has been done to make windows suitable to write in Indian languages. "Everything"? I have no idea what "everything" might be. You can type in the 11 standard Indian scripts without adding anything at all to Windows out-of-the-box. Conjuncts are formed, and matras are placed, automatically as you type the sounds of the letters in the order they are spoken -- you don't even need to type i before the consonant, or o both before and after (Bengali). Once you have selected the (or a) keyboard for your language, you begin to get characters in that script, in whatever the system's default might be. For some it's Arial Unicode, for some it's Sylfaen, for some (Urdu, Sindhi), it's Times New Roman. I am afraid you are not correct. Another point you have put is that unicode has been finalized for Indian languages is also not correct. If you see unicodes used by fonts such as 'mangal' you will see that they are not placed on the unicodes recommended for Indian languages but they are put on other nondescript unicode places. It is hardly Unicode's fault that some font designers have failed to adhere to Unicode standards. I have not heard of "mangal"; for what script is it a font? If windows do that how that can be justified? I want "Windows" do not "do that." Font designers do that. Maybe "mangal" is 20 years old and was made before computers could handle more than 128 or 256 characters. Microsoft to be a perfect instrument to get proper unicodes to be used for these languages. I will add one more page to my blog soon to show you the difference in what unicodes are used by microsoft Indian fonts and what are the actuall unicodes offered by the unicode. I want to know why microsoft is doing this? Is it justified to put fonts of a langauge on wrong unicodes? My Certainly not. intentions are that let us do something that is, in given times, helpful to users in India. Please do not misunderstand me. I want to know what Bob has to say. Please visit my blog after 8 days to avoid any misunderstanding. I Post the link here next week. have internet server problem here and that makes it difficult to do posting in time sorry for that. Remember, we Indians wish to use english version of windows and want to write our messages in Indian languages since that is most convenient at this time. We often toggle between both languages and for that english version is most suitable. with regards. I of course use English version of Windows, and I have no trouble typing in any of the Indian languages. I can toggle between English and any of the languages either by choosing them from the Language Bar, or by pressing LeftAlt+Shift, or by assigning a specific shortcut to each keyboard (though because I use many, many different scripts in my work, I have different selections of keyboards installed at different times, so I don't bother with specific shortcuts except for getting back to English.) "grammatim" wrote: Well, to get the link, I had to go to Bob Buckland's message. The "essay" contains a great deal of blather. I gather "orkut" is an Indian ISP? You seem to have two points. (1) Transliteration is not necessary. (2) Windows cannot properly handle Indian scripts. (1) is a matter of opinion and is correct in some circumstances, incorrect in others. (2), as I and others told you more than half a year ago, is simply incorrect. Every version of Windows since I-don't-know-when has provided full support for typing in the 11 standard scripts of India (roman, Nagari, Gujarati, Gurmukhi, Bengali, Oriya, Kannada, Telugu, Tamil, Malayalam, Urdu), with a dedicated keyboard for each. All of them have been included in Unicode since Version 1.0 nearly 20 years ago. On Sep 14, 5:09 am, Ashok Kothare wrote: I am very sorry that the page on my blog was written next day due to internet problem at my end. Now you can read my article on the page Transliteration and please write back for your comments here and also if possible on the comment box of the blog. That page shall remain on the blog for some time now, for all interested observers. Friend Grammtin, please note. "Bob Buckland ?:-)" wrote: Hi Ashok, Can you provide the link to the specific document you're referring to in your post? The Transliteration article on your blog at http://kothareashok.blog.co.in/transliteration/ basically says 'coming soon'. ============== "Ashok Kothare" Ashok wrote in message ... Friends, I am resuming the dialogue after about seven months. Somebody told me that transliteration is the answer to the problem of Indian language inclusion as default font. I have studied the suggestion and come with reply. that reply is in details and so I have put it on my blog. Please visit my blog to read it. It is a research paper too lengthy for this box. URL of my blog http://kothareashok.blog.co.in and you may reply to it on this site as well as on the comment box. - |
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#32
Posted to microsoft.public.word.docmanagement
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Indian language fonts to be included as default fonts in windo
Once again, you demanded that I read your blog without providing a
link to it. After scrolling back many messages to find the link, I discovered that in the very first sentence of the new addition, you lied about what I said. This is how it starts: *** My stand Grammatim suggests that new version of mangal has 127 characters and they are in the right places given for Devnagari script. If this is so, I mean, new version of mangal has 127 characters then that shows that Microsoft is making one more blunder. How, I shall explain. Font mangal I have is, according to Grammatim, very old font, it has 586 characters and new version has only 127 characters. What happened to all other characters? *** If you will look at the very message you are responding to, you will see that I said that Mangal contains exactly the 110 characters specified by Unicode. Why should I read any essay that so blatantly lies in its opening words? But I go on a few more words and see that you refer to "586 characters." Maybe you are somehow looking at the OpenType resources that _underlie_ the 110 characters. The conjunct aksharas are not individually typed when typing in Nagari; they are automatically called by the computer. Please learn something about how to use your computer before continuing to waste our time. On Sep 24, 7:22*am, Ashok Kothare wrote: How do you know that no one from Microsoft reads this newsgroup? If so why keep it? I have found that Google research reads my comments that means Microsoft definetly knows what is going on in this group. Any way, your advice is perfect but that does not solve the problem. I have put 'My stand' on the page "Grammatim" on my blog. May be it will clear the point. The font I am talking about is copyright 2001. Is it ancient? Unicode were all well set by that time. "grammatim" wrote: No one from Microsoft reads this newsgroup. If the ancient font you insist on continuing to use was made before Unicode was established, you have no right to claim that it does not match Unicode. Just update your computer and download the free fonts. On Sep 23, 3:57 am, Ashok Kothare wrote: Thanks for the reply. I want others in the discussion group to say what they want to say. Your argument does not justify violation of the unicode by Microsoft. Whether latest or very old the violation has been done. That is the point. I wish some person from the Microsoft connected with this font work come up and reply. May be you can arrange for it. May be, dear Grammatim, you are not competent to answer my query. "grammatim" wrote: It has not been "eight days" since your last posting. I have read your blog page called "Grammatim" and I have no idea what you are talking about. Mangal font is on my computer -- installed with Vista last month; until I get my old hard drive back, I cannot know whether some recent earlier version of Mangal did not comply with Unicode -- I opened it with BabelMap and found that it contains every Unicode-specified character in its proper place. (The glyph variants involved in constructing conjuncts and adding matras are handled behind the scenes, by the Devanagari IME.) It is possible that you have a very, very, very old version of Mangal, if you do not have the 110 Mangal characters in their proper places.. |
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#33
Posted to microsoft.public.word.docmanagement
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Indian language fonts to be included as default fonts in windo
Give up, grammatim. It's a lost cause. Ashok doesn't understand English well
enough to pursue this argument logically. -- Suzanne S. Barnhill Microsoft MVP (Word) Words into Type Fairhope, Alabama USA "grammatim" wrote in message ... Once again, you demanded that I read your blog without providing a link to it. After scrolling back many messages to find the link, I discovered that in the very first sentence of the new addition, you lied about what I said. This is how it starts: *** My stand Grammatim suggests that new version of mangal has 127 characters and they are in the right places given for Devnagari script. If this is so, I mean, new version of mangal has 127 characters then that shows that Microsoft is making one more blunder. How, I shall explain. Font mangal I have is, according to Grammatim, very old font, it has 586 characters and new version has only 127 characters. What happened to all other characters? *** If you will look at the very message you are responding to, you will see that I said that Mangal contains exactly the 110 characters specified by Unicode. Why should I read any essay that so blatantly lies in its opening words? But I go on a few more words and see that you refer to "586 characters." Maybe you are somehow looking at the OpenType resources that _underlie_ the 110 characters. The conjunct aksharas are not individually typed when typing in Nagari; they are automatically called by the computer. Please learn something about how to use your computer before continuing to waste our time. On Sep 24, 7:22 am, Ashok Kothare wrote: How do you know that no one from Microsoft reads this newsgroup? If so why keep it? I have found that Google research reads my comments that means Microsoft definetly knows what is going on in this group. Any way, your advice is perfect but that does not solve the problem. I have put 'My stand' on the page "Grammatim" on my blog. May be it will clear the point. The font I am talking about is copyright 2001. Is it ancient? Unicode were all well set by that time. "grammatim" wrote: No one from Microsoft reads this newsgroup. If the ancient font you insist on continuing to use was made before Unicode was established, you have no right to claim that it does not match Unicode. Just update your computer and download the free fonts. On Sep 23, 3:57 am, Ashok Kothare wrote: Thanks for the reply. I want others in the discussion group to say what they want to say. Your argument does not justify violation of the unicode by Microsoft. Whether latest or very old the violation has been done. That is the point. I wish some person from the Microsoft connected with this font work come up and reply. May be you can arrange for it. May be, dear Grammatim, you are not competent to answer my query. "grammatim" wrote: It has not been "eight days" since your last posting. I have read your blog page called "Grammatim" and I have no idea what you are talking about. Mangal font is on my computer -- installed with Vista last month; until I get my old hard drive back, I cannot know whether some recent earlier version of Mangal did not comply with Unicode -- I opened it with BabelMap and found that it contains every Unicode-specified character in its proper place. (The glyph variants involved in constructing conjuncts and adding matras are handled behind the scenes, by the Devanagari IME.) It is possible that you have a very, very, very old version of Mangal, if you do not have the 110 Mangal characters in their proper places. |
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#34
Posted to microsoft.public.word.docmanagement
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Indian language fonts to be included as default fonts in windo
I want to reply in one place and I request Tony and Grammatim to read it from
here. I admit that I wrote 127 and that was a typographic mistake however, it does not rule out the argument. Secondly, my english is Indian and you americans may find it different but that is always the case, when Japanese write english you americans laugh it away.Thirdly, mangal font I have is original microsoft font file copyright 2001. If any one of you is wanting to see it please, send your email ID on my email which is available on my blog. I shall send the font file to you. Tony claims that no body reads from microsoft then, why they keep this discussion group? Just close it in that case. But I know you are all microsoft people and microsoft reads everything through you people. I have circumstantial evidence for that. My complain is no body from you or any other bothered to say anything about microsoft giving same name for two different fonts? Why? Are you afraid to face truth? Finally let me tell you all, my friends, that the blog is being read by people all over the world and many, interested in the topic, are reading the discussion on the blog on page "Grammatim". They are sending their comments to me. I am collecting them all and then publish them in the coming posts, exact post date for that I cannot tell now. Those comments will be published on page "Unicode". I invite you all to visit the blog and know what they say. My blog link is, http://kothareashok.blog.co.in Suzanne S. Barnhill, please pass it to my friend, Grammatim. with regards, Ashok. I want to reply in one place and I request Tony and Grammatim to read it from here. I admit that I wrote 127 and that was a typographic mistake however, it does not rule out the argument. Secondly, my english is Indian and you americans may find it different but that is always the case, when Japanese write english you americans laugh it away.Thirdly, mangal font I have is original microsoft font file copyright 2001. If any one of you is wanting to see it please, send your email ID on my email which is available on my blog. I shall send the font file to you. Tony claims that no body reads from microsoft then, why they keep this discussion group? Just close it in that case. But I know you are all microsoft people and microsoft reads everything through you people. I have circumstantial evidence for that. My complain is no body from you or any other bothered to say anything about microsoft giving same name for two different fonts? Why? Are you afraid to face truth? Finally let me tell you all, my friends, that the blog is being read by people all over the world and many, interested in the topic, are reading the discussion on the blog on page "Grammatim". They are sending their comments to me. I am collecting them all and then publish them in the coming posts, exact post date for that I cannot tell now. Those comments will be published on page "Unicode". I invite you all to visit the blog and know what they say. My blog link is, http://kothareashok.blog.co.in Suzanne S. Barnhill, please pass it to my friend, Grammatim. with regards, Ashok. "Suzanne S. Barnhill" wrote: Give up, grammatim. It's a lost cause. Ashok doesn't understand English well enough to pursue this argument logically. -- Suzanne S. Barnhill Microsoft MVP (Word) Words into Type Fairhope, Alabama USA "grammatim" wrote in message ... Once again, you demanded that I read your blog without providing a link to it. After scrolling back many messages to find the link, I discovered that in the very first sentence of the new addition, you lied about what I said. This is how it starts: *** My stand Grammatim suggests that new version of mangal has 127 characters and they are in the right places given for Devnagari script. If this is so, I mean, new version of mangal has 127 characters then that shows that Microsoft is making one more blunder. How, I shall explain. Font mangal I have is, according to Grammatim, very old font, it has 586 characters and new version has only 127 characters. What happened to all other characters? *** If you will look at the very message you are responding to, you will see that I said that Mangal contains exactly the 110 characters specified by Unicode. Why should I read any essay that so blatantly lies in its opening words? But I go on a few more words and see that you refer to "586 characters." Maybe you are somehow looking at the OpenType resources that _underlie_ the 110 characters. The conjunct aksharas are not individually typed when typing in Nagari; they are automatically called by the computer. Please learn something about how to use your computer before continuing to waste our time. On Sep 24, 7:22 am, Ashok Kothare wrote: How do you know that no one from Microsoft reads this newsgroup? If so why keep it? I have found that Google research reads my comments that means Microsoft definetly knows what is going on in this group. Any way, your advice is perfect but that does not solve the problem. I have put 'My stand' on the page "Grammatim" on my blog. May be it will clear the point. The font I am talking about is copyright 2001. Is it ancient? Unicode were all well set by that time. "grammatim" wrote: No one from Microsoft reads this newsgroup. If the ancient font you insist on continuing to use was made before Unicode was established, you have no right to claim that it does not match Unicode. Just update your computer and download the free fonts. On Sep 23, 3:57 am, Ashok Kothare wrote: Thanks for the reply. I want others in the discussion group to say what they want to say. Your argument does not justify violation of the unicode by Microsoft. Whether latest or very old the violation has been done. That is the point. I wish some person from the Microsoft connected with this font work come up and reply. May be you can arrange for it. May be, dear Grammatim, you are not competent to answer my query. "grammatim" wrote: It has not been "eight days" since your last posting. I have read your blog page called "Grammatim" and I have no idea what you are talking about. Mangal font is on my computer -- installed with Vista last month; until I get my old hard drive back, I cannot know whether some recent earlier version of Mangal did not comply with Unicode -- I opened it with BabelMap and found that it contains every Unicode-specified character in its proper place. (The glyph variants involved in constructing conjuncts and adding matras are handled behind the scenes, by the Devanagari IME.) It is possible that you have a very, very, very old version of Mangal, if you do not have the 110 Mangal characters in their proper places. |
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#35
Posted to microsoft.public.word.docmanagement
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Indian language fonts to be included as default fonts in windo
I admit that I wrote 127 and that was a typographic mistake however, it
does not rule out the argument. What is the argument? What does not work as expected? Tony claims that no body reads from microsoft then, why they keep this discussion group? Just close it in that case. But I know you are all microsoft people ... The discussion group is provided by Microsoft for users to interact with each other. It is not a communication channel with Microsoft. And I can assure you that neither I, nor grammatim, nor Suzanne are Microsoft people, and none of us will pass anything on to Microsoft about this. My complain is no body from you or any other bothered to say anything about microsoft giving same name for two different fonts? This was merely suggested as a possible reason for the problem you are experiencing. It seems as though this is not, in fact, the case. It is, however, unclear as to what the problem actually is? -- Enjoy, Tony www.WordArticles.com |
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