I'm trying to set up my envelope fonts/size the way I want for both the
address and return address, and to keep the settings that way, permanently.

But of course, Word is making it impossible. Yes, I did click "ok" on all
the windows.

So I went into help, and it said to click "default" after making the changes
and to click 'yes' on the window that pop ups, which tells me it'll make
changes to the "normal" doc.

Well, I do. And guess what? When I x out of the window and go back in to see
if my chages are still there, it's back to Words default settings. So it's
not taking my changes.

What am I doing wrong?

Word WILL drive you mad.

Modify the Envelope Address and Envelope Return styles.

--
Suzanne S. Barnhill
Microsoft MVP (Word)
Words into Type
Fairhope, Alabama USA
Word MVP FAQ site: http://word.mvps.org
Email cannot be acknowledged; please post all follow-ups to the newsgroup so
all may benefit.

"Steve" wrote in message
...
I'm trying to set up my envelope fonts/size the way I want for both the
address and return address, and to keep the settings that way,
permanently.

But of course, Word is making it impossible. Yes, I did click "ok" on all
the windows.

So I went into help, and it said to click "default" after making the
changes
and to click 'yes' on the window that pop ups, which tells me it'll make
changes to the "normal" doc.

Well, I do. And guess what? When I x out of the window and go back in to
see
if my chages are still there, it's back to Words default settings. So it's
not taking my changes.

What am I doing wrong?

Word WILL drive you mad.

To elaborate on Suzanne's reply - see
http://www.gmayor.com/changing_envelope_layout.htm

--

Graham Mayor - Word MVP

My web site www.gmayor.com
Word MVP web site http://word.mvps.org




Steve wrote:
I'm trying to set up my envelope fonts/size the way I want for both
the address and return address, and to keep the settings that way,
permanently.

But of course, Word is making it impossible. Yes, I did click "ok" on
all the windows.

So I went into help, and it said to click "default" after making the
changes and to click 'yes' on the window that pop ups, which tells me
it'll make changes to the "normal" doc.

Well, I do. And guess what? When I x out of the window and go back in
to see if my chages are still there, it's back to Words default
settings. So it's not taking my changes.

What am I doing wrong?

Word WILL drive you mad.

I went into the Style section - Modify etc... - and did make the changes.
And they stayed the way I wanted them to. But I just checked, and they've
reverted back to the Ariel defaults.

Grrrr....

I checked out the link. Why is this so darn complicated?
I have to deal with Normal.dots? I'd rather have dental work then deal with
them. Heck, I haven't figured them out in 4 years!

Why can't I just go into the 'envelop' icon, make the changes, click default
- to make them my default- and have them stay that way?

Oh, that would make sense. And we can't have any of that around Word, now
can we?






"Graham Mayor" wrote:

To elaborate on Suzanne's reply - see
http://www.gmayor.com/changing_envelope_layout.htm

--

Graham Mayor - Word MVP

My web site www.gmayor.com
Word MVP web site http://word.mvps.org




Steve wrote:
I'm trying to set up my envelope fonts/size the way I want for both
the address and return address, and to keep the settings that way,
permanently.

But of course, Word is making it impossible. Yes, I did click "ok" on
all the windows.

So I went into help, and it said to click "default" after making the
changes and to click 'yes' on the window that pop ups, which tells me
it'll make changes to the "normal" doc.

Well, I do. And guess what? When I x out of the window and go back in
to see if my chages are still there, it's back to Words default
settings. So it's not taking my changes.

What am I doing wrong?

Word WILL drive you mad.

When you modified the styles, did you check the "Add to template" box?

--
Suzanne S. Barnhill
Microsoft MVP (Word)
Words into Type
Fairhope, Alabama USA
Word MVP FAQ site: http://word.mvps.org
Email cannot be acknowledged; please post all follow-ups to the newsgroup so
all may benefit.

"Steve" wrote in message
...
I went into the Style section - Modify etc... - and did make the changes.
And they stayed the way I wanted them to. But I just checked, and they've
reverted back to the Ariel defaults.

Grrrr....

I checked out the link. Why is this so darn complicated?
I have to deal with Normal.dots? I'd rather have dental work then deal
with
them. Heck, I haven't figured them out in 4 years!

Why can't I just go into the 'envelop' icon, make the changes, click
default
- to make them my default- and have them stay that way?

Oh, that would make sense. And we can't have any of that around Word, now
can we?






"Graham Mayor" wrote:

To elaborate on Suzanne's reply - see
http://www.gmayor.com/changing_envelope_layout.htm

--

Graham Mayor - Word MVP

My web site www.gmayor.com
Word MVP web site http://word.mvps.org




Steve wrote:
I'm trying to set up my envelope fonts/size the way I want for both
the address and return address, and to keep the settings that way,
permanently.

But of course, Word is making it impossible. Yes, I did click "ok" on
all the windows.

So I went into help, and it said to click "default" after making the
changes and to click 'yes' on the window that pop ups, which tells me
it'll make changes to the "normal" doc.

Well, I do. And guess what? When I x out of the window and go back in
to see if my chages are still there, it's back to Words default
settings. So it's not taking my changes.

What am I doing wrong?

Word WILL drive you mad.

Well, it worked...and it didn't. Let me explain from the beginning.

Instead of bothering with Normal.dot and templets that the I'll never figure
out, I set up a document the way I want it - font size and style, L,R,
top/bottom margins and one single tab. I also use a "blue background with
white lettering," but I changed the lettering to a yellowish text color that
I customized myself (so when I print it out, I have to change it to black or
to the automatic white, which would print out black).

Let's give this document a name, let's call it "letter" (when I want to save
a letter, I "save as" with a different file name). So whenever I need to use
Word, I click on the "letter" icon and Word opens, and everything is set up -
including my address in the middle at the tab - exactly as I want it.

Not sure how I did it, but I did what you said. Went into style, made the
changes and clicked "add to templet."

But when I checked, the envelope window still looked as if it had Words
default - didn't work (why should I be surprised?).

So I went back in to the Style windows and one of the change I made, I think
to font style was mine, but the others weren't. So it only took one or two
of my changes. Not all. Didn't matter, if I tried typing out an envelope,
it would use all of Words default style.

So I went back into "letter" and went into "style" and did the whole
envelope thing again. And guess what?

It moved the top line - my street address - from "Letter" to the left margin!

What the heck does messing around with envelope styles have to do with the
document?

It also changed the font color from my yellow to black (Words "automatic
white" in this case is really black, so when I changed my font color to black
in the envelope settings, thinking white meant white, it turned it to black.
So this is something I'll have to deal with.).

And I couldn't "tab" my address back to the tab because the tab was gone!

Yup, this sure makes sense to me!

But when I click the white page icon in the Word task bar to bring up a new
document page, and click the envelope, guess what the defaults are?

Mine! The way I changed to them to. So I guess clicking "add to templete"
worked...for these pages, not "letter."

So from now on, when I want to print out an envelope, I'll just have to
click the new page icon and do it from there (Well, let's see what happens.
Chances are it'll revert back to Word's default in a few days.)

But I don't understand. If I can create a document with my font style and
size, even text color, and SAVE it, why can't I do the same for envelopes?

Also, why is this so darn complicated? How the hell is the average person -
who barely knows word processing - gonna figure out how to create Normal dots
for envelopes by going into style...and clicking on "add to template," when
they don't know what the hell templates are?

This shouldn't have to be brain surgery.

And why does Word play with your head by allowing you to change the defaults
of the envelope by simply clicking on the envelope icon and going into
options - BUT IT'S NOT GOING TO WORK?

Thanks for you help.

PS - How you keep your sanity?










"Suzanne S. Barnhill" wrote:

When you modified the styles, did you check the "Add to template" box?

--
Suzanne S. Barnhill
Microsoft MVP (Word)
Words into Type
Fairhope, Alabama USA
Word MVP FAQ site: http://word.mvps.org
Email cannot be acknowledged; please post all follow-ups to the newsgroup so
all may benefit.

"Steve" wrote in message
...
I went into the Style section - Modify etc... - and did make the changes.
And they stayed the way I wanted them to. But I just checked, and they've
reverted back to the Ariel defaults.

Grrrr....

I checked out the link. Why is this so darn complicated?
I have to deal with Normal.dots? I'd rather have dental work then deal
with
them. Heck, I haven't figured them out in 4 years!

Why can't I just go into the 'envelop' icon, make the changes, click
default
- to make them my default- and have them stay that way?

Oh, that would make sense. And we can't have any of that around Word, now
can we?






"Graham Mayor" wrote:

To elaborate on Suzanne's reply - see
http://www.gmayor.com/changing_envelope_layout.htm

--

Graham Mayor - Word MVP

My web site www.gmayor.com
Word MVP web site http://word.mvps.org




Steve wrote:
I'm trying to set up my envelope fonts/size the way I want for both
the address and return address, and to keep the settings that way,
permanently.

But of course, Word is making it impossible. Yes, I did click "ok" on
all the windows.

So I went into help, and it said to click "default" after making the
changes and to click 'yes' on the window that pop ups, which tells me
it'll make changes to the "normal" doc.

Well, I do. And guess what? When I x out of the window and go back in
to see if my chages are still there, it's back to Words default
settings. So it's not taking my changes.

What am I doing wrong?

Word WILL drive you mad.

Well, your last question is really the appropriate one: Why does Word lead
you to believe that you can change the defaults if you can't? And I don't
know the answer to that. I haven't created an envelope with the Tools |
Envelopes and Labels dialog in years (maybe ever) because I have individual
templates for all my envelopes (in a myriad of different sizes and styles).
What I can tell you is that when you finally succeeded in changing the style
for new envelopes, it was because you saved the changes to Normal.dot. This
did *not* affect the fonts in your Letter document or template because it
had already been created, and a document is cut off from its template at the
moment of creation. You could perhaps reattach Normal.dot to your document
with "Automatically update document styles" checked, but in this case it
would probably be easier to change the styles in your document.

What you may have overlooked in dealing with the envelope styles is that the
Envelope Address style includes a frame. If you inadvertently move this
frame, then your address will be in the wrong place. I've never understood
why Word makes the frame so wide and gives the paragraph in it a large
indent to compensate. The only thing I can think of was that it was allowing
for you to unindent and add a notice such as PERSONAL or CONFIDENTIAL or VIA
AIR MAIL above the address. In any case, that just adds one more layer of
complexity to what you are dealing with. I find it helpful to have text
boundaries displayed so that I get a visual clue when there are frames on
the page (though when you are working in one, you should see the hashed
border around it).

--
Suzanne S. Barnhill
Microsoft MVP (Word)
Words into Type
Fairhope, Alabama USA
Word MVP FAQ site: http://word.mvps.org
Email cannot be acknowledged; please post all follow-ups to the newsgroup so
all may benefit.

"Steve" wrote in message
...
Well, it worked...and it didn't. Let me explain from the beginning.

Instead of bothering with Normal.dot and templets that the I'll never
figure
out, I set up a document the way I want it - font size and style, L,R,
top/bottom margins and one single tab. I also use a "blue background with
white lettering," but I changed the lettering to a yellowish text color
that
I customized myself (so when I print it out, I have to change it to black
or
to the automatic white, which would print out black).

Let's give this document a name, let's call it "letter" (when I want to
save
a letter, I "save as" with a different file name). So whenever I need to
use
Word, I click on the "letter" icon and Word opens, and everything is set
up -
including my address in the middle at the tab - exactly as I want it.

Not sure how I did it, but I did what you said. Went into style, made the
changes and clicked "add to templet."

But when I checked, the envelope window still looked as if it had Words
default - didn't work (why should I be surprised?).

So I went back in to the Style windows and one of the change I made, I
think
to font style was mine, but the others weren't. So it only took one or
two
of my changes. Not all. Didn't matter, if I tried typing out an
envelope,
it would use all of Words default style.

So I went back into "letter" and went into "style" and did the whole
envelope thing again. And guess what?

It moved the top line - my street address - from "Letter" to the left
margin!

What the heck does messing around with envelope styles have to do with the
document?

It also changed the font color from my yellow to black (Words "automatic
white" in this case is really black, so when I changed my font color to
black
in the envelope settings, thinking white meant white, it turned it to
black.
So this is something I'll have to deal with.).

And I couldn't "tab" my address back to the tab because the tab was gone!

Yup, this sure makes sense to me!

But when I click the white page icon in the Word task bar to bring up a
new
document page, and click the envelope, guess what the defaults are?

Mine! The way I changed to them to. So I guess clicking "add to templete"
worked...for these pages, not "letter."

So from now on, when I want to print out an envelope, I'll just have to
click the new page icon and do it from there (Well, let's see what
happens.
Chances are it'll revert back to Word's default in a few days.)

But I don't understand. If I can create a document with my font style and
size, even text color, and SAVE it, why can't I do the same for envelopes?

Also, why is this so darn complicated? How the hell is the average
person -
who barely knows word processing - gonna figure out how to create Normal
dots
for envelopes by going into style...and clicking on "add to template,"
when
they don't know what the hell templates are?

This shouldn't have to be brain surgery.

And why does Word play with your head by allowing you to change the
defaults
of the envelope by simply clicking on the envelope icon and going into
options - BUT IT'S NOT GOING TO WORK?

Thanks for you help.

PS - How you keep your sanity?










"Suzanne S. Barnhill" wrote:

When you modified the styles, did you check the "Add to template" box?

--
Suzanne S. Barnhill
Microsoft MVP (Word)
Words into Type
Fairhope, Alabama USA
Word MVP FAQ site: http://word.mvps.org
Email cannot be acknowledged; please post all follow-ups to the
newsgroup so
all may benefit.

"Steve" wrote in message
...
I went into the Style section - Modify etc... - and did make the
changes.
And they stayed the way I wanted them to. But I just checked, and
they've
reverted back to the Ariel defaults.

Grrrr....

I checked out the link. Why is this so darn complicated?
I have to deal with Normal.dots? I'd rather have dental work then
deal
with
them. Heck, I haven't figured them out in 4 years!

Why can't I just go into the 'envelop' icon, make the changes, click
default
- to make them my default- and have them stay that way?

Oh, that would make sense. And we can't have any of that around Word,
now
can we?






"Graham Mayor" wrote:

To elaborate on Suzanne's reply - see
http://www.gmayor.com/changing_envelope_layout.htm

--

Graham Mayor - Word MVP

My web site www.gmayor.com
Word MVP web site http://word.mvps.org




Steve wrote:
I'm trying to set up my envelope fonts/size the way I want for
both
the address and return address, and to keep the settings that way,
permanently.

But of course, Word is making it impossible. Yes, I did click "ok"
on
all the windows.

So I went into help, and it said to click "default" after making
the
changes and to click 'yes' on the window that pop ups, which tells
me
it'll make changes to the "normal" doc.

Well, I do. And guess what? When I x out of the window and go back
in
to see if my chages are still there, it's back to Words default
settings. So it's not taking my changes.

What am I doing wrong?

Word WILL drive you mad.

"Suzanne S. Barnhill" wrote:

What I can tell you is that when you finally succeeded in changing the style
for new envelopes, it was because you saved the changes to Normal.dot.

I did?


This
did *not* affect the fonts in your Letter document or template because it
had already been created, and a document is cut off from its template at the
moment of creation.

ouch.


You could perhaps reattach Normal.dot to your document
with "Automatically update document styles" checked,

I'm going to take the "do no harm" approach at this point.


but in this case it
would probably be easier to change the styles in your document.

"letter?" I did, I think I did. Didn't work.


What you may have overlooked in dealing with the envelope styles is that the
Envelope Address style includes a frame. If you inadvertently move this
frame,

No, not at all. I never saw any 'frame.' I was only in the settings windows.


then your address will be in the wrong place.

No. My address on my document moved to the left tab, while messing around
with the envelope settings.

One more question: When I click the blank icon page (outside of "letter")
and click the envelope icon, *my* defaults come up...how would I change the
placement of the envelope and return address's?

You can make these changes by going into "options" from the envelope icon
(you can have the address print way over to the left side of the envelope if
you wanted to). But of course that doesn't work. That would be too easy.

So if I go into the envelope and return address "Style's", and "Modify," how
do I set my own placement points? (some people might want the address to be
higher on the envelope then the default if they type out a lot of 5 line
address.)

If I click "format" inside "modify" there is "paragraph" and that does have
"indentation" left (and right) but no top or bottom, so that can't be it.

More Word craziness: If I click the envelope icon inside my "letter"
document, the window pops up, I see my address in the return address window
(makes sense, I have my address in the "letter") in Ariel, words default.

If I click "options" and then hit the "x" to get out of the window, without
doing anything, my address turns into the font/size I've been trying to
change it to.

But when I type in a delivery address, it's ariel.

Thanks.