[Larry]

Here's a fun one.

1) In Word 2003, show the Styles and Formatting pane. Set its contents
to show Available Formatting.

2) Click in a styled paragraph in the document. Let's say the
paragraph style for that text is named XYZ. IMPORTANT: Ensure that the
font scale for style XYZ is something other than 100%. Modify the
style if necessary.

3) Confirm that there are no variants of XYZ showing in the Styles and
Formatting pane.

3) Insert a textbox at the cursor point.

4) Note that there now exists an "XYZ + Font: Character scale: 100%"
format in the Styles and Formatting pane.

5) Change the style of the paragraph (where the textbox is anchored)
to some other style -- call it "ABC" -- that also does NOT have a font
scale of 100%.

6) Note that the formatting "XYZ + Font: Character scale: 100%"
disappears from the Styles and Formatting pane, and that the
formatting "ABC + Font: Character scale: 100%" appears.

Now, aside from this being a heck of a lot of fun, it's also
undesirable behaviour. Any ideas how I can get it to stop? (VBA
solutions acceptable, I'm semi-fluent.)

TIA...
--larry

[Jay Freedman]

Things that look like "style name + other formatting" are not really
styles. They're artifacts produced when you have the "Keep track of
formatting" option checked in Tools Options Edit and there is direct
formatting applied in addition to the underlying style.

To get rid of the artifacts, just uncheck the option.

--
Regards,
Jay Freedman
Microsoft Word MVP FAQ: http://word.mvps.org
Email cannot be acknowledged; please post all follow-ups to the newsgroup so
all may benefit.

Larry wrote:
Here's a fun one.

1) In Word 2003, show the Styles and Formatting pane. Set its contents
to show Available Formatting.

2) Click in a styled paragraph in the document. Let's say the
paragraph style for that text is named XYZ. IMPORTANT: Ensure that the
font scale for style XYZ is something other than 100%. Modify the
style if necessary.

3) Confirm that there are no variants of XYZ showing in the Styles and
Formatting pane.

3) Insert a textbox at the cursor point.

4) Note that there now exists an "XYZ + Font: Character scale: 100%"
format in the Styles and Formatting pane.

5) Change the style of the paragraph (where the textbox is anchored)
to some other style -- call it "ABC" -- that also does NOT have a font
scale of 100%.

6) Note that the formatting "XYZ + Font: Character scale: 100%"
disappears from the Styles and Formatting pane, and that the
formatting "ABC + Font: Character scale: 100%" appears.

Now, aside from this being a heck of a lot of fun, it's also
undesirable behaviour. Any ideas how I can get it to stop? (VBA
solutions acceptable, I'm semi-fluent.)

TIA...
--larry

[Larry]

On Aug 1, 11:10*am, "Jay Freedman" wrote:
Things that look like "style name + other formatting" are not really
styles. They're artifacts produced when you have the "Keep track of
formatting" option checked in Tools Options Edit and there is direct
formatting applied in addition to the underlying style.

To get rid of the artifacts, just uncheck the option.


Thanks, Jay, and I realised that, but maybe there is something about
these artefacts that I don't understand.

Q1. If the "Keep track of formatting" option is unchecked, then the
artefacts are not created? Or simply not reported in the list? The
reason this is important is that we need to know if users
inadvertently apply local (direct) formatting. (Yes, in future I will
just be protecting the document to prevent this, but for various
reasons I can't implement that solution right now.)

Q2. Why would insertion of a textbox apply any direct formatting at
all? The direct formatting does not exist until the textbox is
inserted, and disappears if the textbox is removed.

---
larry

[Jay Freedman]

On Fri, 1 Aug 2008 08:50:10 -0700 (PDT), Larry wrote:

On Aug 1, 11:10*am, "Jay Freedman" wrote:
Things that look like "style name + other formatting" are not really
styles. They're artifacts produced when you have the "Keep track of
formatting" option checked in Tools Options Edit and there is direct
formatting applied in addition to the underlying style.

To get rid of the artifacts, just uncheck the option.


Thanks, Jay, and I realised that, but maybe there is something about
these artefacts that I don't understand.

Q1. If the "Keep track of formatting" option is unchecked, then the
artefacts are not created? Or simply not reported in the list? The
reason this is important is that we need to know if users
inadvertently apply local (direct) formatting. (Yes, in future I will
just be protecting the document to prevent this, but for various
reasons I can't implement that solution right now.)

Q2. Why would insertion of a textbox apply any direct formatting at
all? The direct formatting does not exist until the textbox is
inserted, and disappears if the textbox is removed.

---
larry

First, let me note that I've now tried the exact steps in your original post in
a copy of Word 2003 (I didn't have that version available earlier), and I don't
see the behavior you described. When I insert a text box, no matter what the
style or direct formatting of the text at the insertion point, the text box is
formatted with Normal style, and I do *not* see any entry in the Styles pane
that includes "+ Character scale: 100%".

In fact, I see some behavior that I'd consider the opposite of what you
described:

- I turned on the "Keep track of formatting" option.

- I created a style named XYZ, and defined it as Normal plus character scaling
of 150%.

- I applied style XYZ to a paragraph of regular text. Then I applied direct
formatting of character scaling 100%. The entry "XYZ + Character scaling: 100%"
appears and is highlighted in the Styles pane as expected.

- In separate steps, starting once with the cursor in Normal-style text and once
with it in XYZ-style text, I added text boxes. Both of them appeared with Normal
style applied to the interior empty paragraph. Nothing changed in the Styles
pane, except that Normal was highlighted there.

- In either text box, I applied XYZ style to the interior paragraph and then
direct-applied character scaling 100%. The "XYZ + Character scaling: 100%"
pseudo-style was *not* selected in the Styles pane as it was when I did this to
regular text. That entry is still in the pane, but it's ignored. If I click it
to try to apply it, nothing happens.

----------

To try to answer your latest questions:

Q1. If the "Keep track of formatting" option is unchecked, then the
artefacts are not created? Or simply not reported in the list?

Well, that's what I mean by "artefact" -- it's something that doesn't really
exist but *appears* to exist because you asked Word to show it by checking the
option. What really exists is direct formatting overlying a paragraph style.

If you need to know whether direct formatting has been applied, turning on the
option will tell you (unless the formatting exists in a text box, or possibly in
some other places that I haven't yet stumbled across). You might even be able to
use the "Select all n instances" button on the style's dropdown in the Styles
pane to find out where.

Q2. Why would insertion of a textbox apply any direct formatting at
all?

As I said above, that doesn't happen when I try it. If it happens in your
documents, I don't know how or why. It shouldn't affect the text at the
insertion point at all; and the text inside the box should be styled as Normal.

--
Regards,
Jay Freedman
Microsoft Word MVP FAQ: http://word.mvps.org
Email cannot be acknowledged; please post all follow-ups to the newsgroup so all may benefit.

[Larry]

On Aug 1, 8:09*pm, Jay Freedman wrote:

First, let me note that I've now tried the exact steps in your original post in
a copy of Word 2003 (I didn't have that version available earlier), and I don't
see the behavior you described. When I insert a text box, no matter what the
style or direct formatting of the text at the insertion point, the text box is
formatted with Normal style, and I do *not* see any entry in the Styles pane
that includes "+ Character scale: 100%".

This is so strange. Just to double-check, I followed along with your
steps.

- I turned on the "Keep track of formatting" option.

Did that.

- I created a style named XYZ, and defined it as Normal plus character scaling
of 150%.

Did that.

- I applied style XYZ to a paragraph of regular text. Then I applied direct
formatting of character scaling 100%. The entry "XYZ + Character scaling: 100%"
appears and is highlighted in the Styles pane as expected.

Did that. But then undid it because I didn't want to get confused
between my manual scaling and what the textbox insertion step, next,
might do. That is, I didn't want to ALREADY have "XYZ + Character
scaling: 100%" in the Styles pane since I was about to check whether
inserting a textbox would create this style variant on its own.

- In separate steps, starting once with the cursor in Normal-style text and once
with it in XYZ-style text, I added text boxes. Both of them appeared with Normal
style applied to the interior empty paragraph. Nothing changed in the Styles
pane, except that Normal was highlighted there.

Did that, and for me, the instant I inserted the textbox in the XYZ-
styled text, an additional entry in the Styles and Formatting pane
appeared: "XYZ + Character scaling: 100%". It isn't visibly applied to
anything in the main body or the textbox. It's just there. As we say
way up north: WTF????

- In either text box, I applied XYZ style to the interior paragraph and then
direct-applied character scaling 100%. The "XYZ + Character scaling: 100%"
pseudo-style was *not* selected in the Styles pane as it was when I did this to
regular text. That entry is still in the pane, but it's ignored. If I click it
to try to apply it, nothing happens.

Weird. I guess we'll have to chalk it up to MS Word strangeness.

If you need to know whether direct formatting has been applied, turning on the
option will tell you (unless the formatting exists in a text box, or possibly in
some other places that I haven't yet stumbled across). You might even be able to
use the "Select all n instances" button on the style's dropdown in the Styles
pane to find out where.

Actually it does report that it is used in one location. But even
though I can select it, there is no visible evidence of the style
variant really being used.

Q2. Why would insertion of a textbox apply any direct formatting at
all?

As I said above, that doesn't happen when I try it. If it happens in your
documents, I don't know how or why. It shouldn't affect the text at the
insertion point at all; and the text inside the box should be styled as Normal.

The biggest problem is that we build our workflow around the idea that
users don't use local formatting, so this "surprise" style variant
upsets the apple cart a bit. But as I mentioned earlier, we'll find
ways to work around it.

Thanks for looking into this, Jay.

---
larry